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Abesha name thing

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Mare Dibaba Hursa is from Oromo ethnic group which is cushitic, not Abesha. Abesha people are semitic and live in northern Ethiopia. Mare Dibaba has nothing to do with Abesha people. The term this article contains Habesha name is inappropriate and I find it racist because it gives here another identify which is not hers. Tumsaa (talk) 08:33, 2 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2015-09-02T08:33:00.000Z","author":"Tumsaa","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-Tumsaa-2015-09-02T08:33:00.000Z-Abesha_name_thing","replies":[]}}-->

So why not just remove that line? I just did. It didn't seem relevant to the article. I don't think the line was racist but I'm pretty ignorant of these issues. Clicking on the "habesha name" link didn't seem to imply that Mare was Habesha - it just explained that "Dibaba" came from her father's given name. This is extremely unusual for people of European descent (e.g. Americans) and may help people confused by her name versus her parent's names. --Gr5555 (talk) 13:15, 2 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2015-09-02T13:15:00.000Z","author":"Gr5555","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-Gr5555-2015-09-02T13:15:00.000Z-Abesha_name_thing","replies":["c-Gyrofrog-2015-09-02T15:33:00.000Z-Gr5555-2015-09-02T13:15:00.000Z"]}}-->

The hatnote was there to explain that the person is known as "Mare" and not Dibaba or Hursa (in case a reade or editor is wondering about MOS:SURNAME). Unless, in fact, that is the case -- I've also left a response at Talk:Habesha name#Abesha name. -- Gyrofrog (talk) 15:33, 2 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2015-09-02T15:33:00.000Z","author":"Gyrofrog","type":"comment","level":2,"id":"c-Gyrofrog-2015-09-02T15:33:00.000Z-Gr5555-2015-09-02T13:15:00.000Z","replies":[]}}-->

Interesting. Do you think this term is more appropriate: Patronymic Name ? --Gr5555 (talk) 16:01, 2 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2015-09-02T16:01:00.000Z","author":"Gr5555","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-Gr5555-2015-09-02T16:01:00.000Z-Abesha_name_thing","replies":["c-Tumsaa-2015-09-04T10:43:00.000Z-Gr5555-2015-09-02T16:01:00.000Z","c-Gyrofrog-2015-09-02T16:40:00.000Z-Gr5555-2015-09-02T16:01:00.000Z"]}}-->

Yes, patronymic name is more appropriate than Habesha name. Mare is from Oromo ethnic group who use patronymic naming convention. Tumsaa (talk) 10:43, 4 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2015-09-04T10:43:00.000Z","author":"Tumsaa","type":"comment","level":2,"id":"c-Tumsaa-2015-09-04T10:43:00.000Z-Gr5555-2015-09-02T16:01:00.000Z","replies":[]}}-->

It might be more appropriate for this article, which I assume is what you meant. (For some reason I thought you meant for the Habesha name article, but I am undercaffeinated.) But I don't know of a hatnote template for it, for example in Category:Hatnote templates for names. -- Gyrofrog (talk) 16:40, 2 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2015-09-02T16:40:00.000Z","author":"Gyrofrog","type":"comment","level":2,"id":"c-Gyrofrog-2015-09-02T16:40:00.000Z-Gr5555-2015-09-02T16:01:00.000Z","replies":[]}}-->

Okay - I'll create a patronymic one tonight and let you know about it. --Gr5555 (talk) 17:20, 2 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2015-09-02T17:20:00.000Z","author":"Gr5555","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-Gr5555-2015-09-02T17:20:00.000Z-Abesha_name_thing","replies":[]}}-->

Done. I created a patronymic template and added it to the Mare page. It may get deleted within a few hours - don't know but it works for now. If it doesn't get deleted it should soon be indexed and listed on this page: Category:Hatnote templates for names. Gyrofrog - if you add this template to a few other pages it is probably much less likely for the template to be deleted. --Gr5555 (talk) 19:49, 2 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2015-09-02T19:49:00.000Z","author":"Gr5555","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-Gr5555-2015-09-02T19:49:00.000Z-Abesha_name_thing","replies":["c-Gyrofrog-2015-09-02T20:40:00.000Z-Gr5555-2015-09-02T19:49:00.000Z","c-Tumsaa-2015-09-04T11:49:00.000Z-Gr5555-2015-09-02T19:49:00.000Z"]}}-->

Thanks, I'm just not sure where else to add it. I might have suggested that a better wording for the documentation would be "may consider this label as inaccurate or inappropriate" rather than "…as racist or offensive" -- while I don't think that's for me to say (being neither Habesha nor from Ethiopia), I think it's much more likely that the template was simply being used (or, intended) as an explanatory hatnote rather than some kind of ethnic assertion. WP:AGF and so forth. -- Gyrofrog (talk) 20:40, 2 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2015-09-02T20:40:00.000Z","author":"Gyrofrog","type":"comment","level":2,"id":"c-Gyrofrog-2015-09-02T20:40:00.000Z-Gr5555-2015-09-02T19:49:00.000Z","replies":[]}}-->

Thanks for creating the patronymic name template. This could avoid a lot of confusion as well as wrong conclusion regarding the ethnic background of the person in an article. It is very important that we avoid such indirect but wrong deductions from happening. Tumsaa (talk) 11:49, 4 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2015-09-04T11:49:00.000Z","author":"Tumsaa","type":"comment","level":2,"id":"c-Tumsaa-2015-09-04T11:49:00.000Z-Gr5555-2015-09-02T19:49:00.000Z","replies":[]}}-->

Yes well there's the "hate" type of racism and then there's the "ignorance" kind of racism. Ignorance is everywhere and I'm certainly ignorant as I never heard of cushitic or abesha and so on and wouldn't know a slur if I heard one. The notes on the Habesha name hatnote explain that it's not trying to imply that people with this note are Abesha but that's an obscure place to put the note so I think having this other hatnote might be better.

Regarding who else to add it to - here's a potential list - please help me out by finding one or two of these people who are Cushitic and not Abesha: Special:WhatLinksHere/Template:Habesha_name --Gr5555 (talk) 22:44, 2 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2015-09-02T22:44:00.000Z","author":"Gr5555","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-Gr5555-2015-09-02T22:44:00.000Z-Abesha_name_thing","replies":["c-Gyrofrog-2015-09-03T15:16:00.000Z-Gr5555-2015-09-02T22:44:00.000Z"]}}-->

Gr5555 and Tumsaa, I've left a response at Template talk:Patronymic name and suggest we continue there, as our discussion is less and less about Mare Dibaba. Thanks for your efforts, Gr5555! -- Gyrofrog (talk) 15:16, 3 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2015-09-03T15:16:00.000Z","author":"Gyrofrog","type":"comment","level":2,"id":"c-Gyrofrog-2015-09-03T15:16:00.000Z-Gr5555-2015-09-02T22:44:00.000Z","replies":[]}}-->

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External links modified

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