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Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Physics/Archive October 2024
There is a discussion on the talk page for Cyclotron on whether the Variable Energy Cyclotron Centre should be included on the "list of notable cyclotrons." PianoDan (talk) 19:06, 1 October 2024 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20241001190600","author":"PianoDan","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-PianoDan-20241001190600-Notable_Cyclotrons_List","replies":["c-PianoDan-20241004160300-PianoDan-20241001190600"]}}-->
- This has now turned into an entire list of "Superconducting Cyclotrons". There is a discussion of whether such a list is necessary, which would be nice to have a few more contributors. PianoDan (talk) 16:03, 4 October 2024 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20241004160300","author":"PianoDan","type":"comment","level":2,"id":"c-PianoDan-20241004160300-PianoDan-20241001190600","replies":["c-Johnjbarton-20241004162900-PianoDan-20241004160300"]}}-->
- If we split the article to create List of Superconducting Cyclotrons then link the list in Cyclotron the effect is to create a somewhat complicated See Also. That would allow fans of Lists to list away and Cyclotron can stay focused. As a reader that would be an improvement since I never look at List of articles. Johnjbarton (talk) 16:29, 4 October 2024 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20241004162900","author":"Johnjbarton","type":"comment","level":3,"id":"c-Johnjbarton-20241004162900-PianoDan-20241004160300","replies":[]}}-->
Earth's magnetic field has been nominated for a good article reassessment. If you are interested in the discussion, please participate by adding your comments to the reassessment page. If concerns are not addressed during the review period, the good article status may be removed from the article. Z1720 (talk) 15:28, 14 October 2024 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20241014152800","author":"Z1720","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-Z1720-20241014152800-Good_article_reassessment_for_Earth's_magnetic_field","replies":[]}}-->
In recent Nobel Laureates articles people have used ScholarGPS to indicate that the laureates are highly cited per that source. Is that source reliable or important in any sense? ReyHahn (talk) 08:20, 13 October 2024 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20241013082000","author":"ReyHahn","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-ReyHahn-20241013082000-ScholarGPS","replies":["c-Xxanthippe-20241013083000-ReyHahn-20241013082000","c-XOR'easter-20241017202200-ReyHahn-20241013082000"]}}-->
- Please give a link to ScholarGPS. Xxanthippe (talk) 08:30, 13 October 2024 (UTC).__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20241013083000","author":"Xxanthippe","type":"comment","level":2,"id":"c-Xxanthippe-20241013083000-ReyHahn-20241013082000","replies":["c-ReyHahn-20241013083300-Xxanthippe-20241013083000"]}}-->
- Oh sorry! Here is an example from John Hopfield article: [1].--ReyHahn (talk) 08:33, 13 October 2024 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20241013083300","author":"ReyHahn","type":"comment","level":3,"id":"c-ReyHahn-20241013083300-Xxanthippe-20241013083000","replies":["c-Xxanthippe-20241013100700-ReyHahn-20241013083300"]}}-->
- I am not familiar with that data base but it looks reputable. Xxanthippe (talk) 10:07, 13 October 2024 (UTC).__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20241013100700","author":"Xxanthippe","type":"comment","level":4,"id":"c-Xxanthippe-20241013100700-ReyHahn-20241013083300","replies":["c-ReyHahn-20241013101300-Xxanthippe-20241013100700"]}}-->
- Should it appear in a least of awards? Is it notable? Example:" In 2023, he was named a Highly Ranked Scholar by ScholarGPS for lifetime".--ReyHahn (talk) 10:13, 13 October 2024 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20241013101300","author":"ReyHahn","type":"comment","level":5,"id":"c-ReyHahn-20241013101300-Xxanthippe-20241013100700","replies":["c-Primefac-20241013121600-ReyHahn-20241013101300"]}}-->
- No; assigning an arbitrary number to someone's citation index and calling them "highly ranked" (on the group's own website) isn't much more relevant than Facebook giving a "verified" check mark. This isn't an award, it's a piece of flair. I've removed it from the article but am willing to discuss it further. Primefac (talk) 12:16, 13 October 2024 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20241013121600","author":"Primefac","type":"comment","level":6,"id":"c-Primefac-20241013121600-ReyHahn-20241013101300","replies":["c-ReyHahn-20241013140500-Primefac-20241013121600"]}}-->
- That was my impression I will remove it from other articles too.--ReyHahn (talk) 14:05, 13 October 2024 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20241013140500","author":"ReyHahn","type":"comment","level":7,"id":"c-ReyHahn-20241013140500-Primefac-20241013121600","replies":["c-Ldm1954-20241013212000-ReyHahn-20241013140500"]}}-->
- It is very marginal. I checked two living people I know and their h-factors were about correct. Then I checked two others who passed away with the last few years and it was a disastrous underestimate. Maybe it will get better, but at the moment I would not want to trust it. Ldm1954 (talk) 21:20, 13 October 2024 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20241013212000","author":"Ldm1954","type":"comment","level":8,"id":"c-Ldm1954-20241013212000-ReyHahn-20241013140500","replies":[]}}-->
- Well, I've never heard of it. XOR'easter (talk) 20:22, 17 October 2024 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20241017202200","author":"XOR'easter","type":"comment","level":2,"id":"c-XOR'easter-20241017202200-ReyHahn-20241013082000","replies":[]}}-->
As in last year, I am trying to make this year Nobel prize related articles better, specially the biographies as we have a WP:BLP rule and many people visit them. However there are always other articles that need help. This year the physics prize is about artificial networks, I know just a little about that but one of the laureates is John Hopfield so articles related to polaritons need a help (specially since we have a lot of them exciton-polariton, phonon polariton and so on. In particular, Hopfield dielectric has just one primary source. Any help is welcomed. ReyHahn (talk) 17:27, 8 October 2024 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20241008172700","author":"ReyHahn","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-ReyHahn-20241008172700-Nobel_2024","replies":["c-Ldm1954-20241016225900-ReyHahn-20241008172700"]}}-->
- Did you look at 2024 Nobel Prize in Physics? That looks very odd to me, particularly the statement about "controversial" with one source looks very non-WP:NPOV. I wonder about a PROD as Wp:! Ldm1954 (talk) 22:59, 16 October 2024 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20241016225900","author":"Ldm1954","type":"comment","level":2,"id":"c-Ldm1954-20241016225900-ReyHahn-20241008172700","replies":["c-Johnjbarton-20241016231500-Ldm1954-20241016225900"]}}-->
- I removed the sentence and opened a discussion in the Talk page. Johnjbarton (talk) 23:15, 16 October 2024 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20241016231500","author":"Johnjbarton","type":"comment","level":3,"id":"c-Johnjbarton-20241016231500-Ldm1954-20241016225900","replies":["c-ReyHahn-20241017073800-Johnjbarton-20241016231500"]}}-->
- I think that page should be removed entirely we do not have individual Nobel prizes pages so far.--ReyHahn (talk) 07:38, 17 October 2024 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20241017073800","author":"ReyHahn","type":"comment","level":4,"id":"c-ReyHahn-20241017073800-Johnjbarton-20241016231500","replies":["c-Ldm1954-20241017101100-ReyHahn-20241017073800"]}}-->
- 👍 Ldm1954 (talk) 10:11, 17 October 2024 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20241017101100","author":"Ldm1954","type":"comment","level":5,"id":"c-Ldm1954-20241017101100-ReyHahn-20241017073800","replies":[]}}-->
Merge
Per refusal to remove the article by the author. It has now become a merge discussion here: Talk:2024 Nobel Prize in Physics.--ReyHahn (talk) 07:00, 18 October 2024 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20241018070000","author":"ReyHahn","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-ReyHahn-20241018070000-Merge","replies":[]}}-->
A discussion of lowercasing the titles of all tectonic plates on Wikipedia was relisted at Talk:Eurasian Plate#Requested move 6 October 2024 a few days ago. Editors here may have an interest in participating before it closes. Randy Kryn (talk) 14:38, 18 October 2024 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20241018143800","author":"Randy Kryn","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-Randy_Kryn-20241018143800-Lowercasing_of_all_tectonic_plates_discussed_in_a_relisted_RM","replies":[]}}-->
I would like some second (third, fourth) opinions on Weber-Maxwell electrodynamics. My feeling is that the current page implies that this approach is a viable alternative to standard electrodynamics. (It has other issues such as being a textbook and long sections without sources which are thus OR.) It looks like it was accepted on AfC in good faith by an editor who is not a physics expert, so might not have been aware of the issues.
In the interim I have added a few tags to it. Maybe some clear edits to indicate that it is not fully adequate, or something harsher. Ldm1954 (talk) 12:55, 25 October 2024 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20241025125500","author":"Ldm1954","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-Ldm1954-20241025125500-Second_opinions_on_Weber-Maxwell_electrodynamics","replies":["c-J\u00e4hmefyysikko-20241025143100-Ldm1954-20241025125500","c-Johnjbarton-20241025152700-Ldm1954-20241025125500"]}}-->
- Google Scholar search for "Weber–Maxwell Electrodynamics" only returns a few articles from a single author with a small number of citations—mostly self cites—so the subject seems to fail WP:GNG. Jähmefyysikko (talk) 14:31, 25 October 2024 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20241025143100","author":"J\u00e4hmefyysikko","type":"comment","level":2,"id":"c-J\u00e4hmefyysikko-20241025143100-Ldm1954-20241025125500","replies":[]}}-->
- Based on a recent negative episode I experienced, I strongly encourage everyone to move this discussion to Talk: Weber-Maxwell electrodynamics. Our discussions should include editors focused on that article who may not attend this page. Johnjbarton (talk) 15:27, 25 October 2024 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20241025152700","author":"Johnjbarton","type":"comment","level":2,"id":"c-Johnjbarton-20241025152700-Ldm1954-20241025125500","replies":["c-Ldm1954-20241025153600-Johnjbarton-20241025152700"]}}-->
- Done, I copied everything with the exception of John's suggestion. There should be a way to link as is done with GA and other nominations, if someone knows how to please let me know. Ldm1954 (talk) 15:36, 25 October 2024 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20241025153600","author":"Ldm1954","type":"comment","level":3,"id":"c-Ldm1954-20241025153600-Johnjbarton-20241025152700","replies":[]}}-->
Does this really merit a separate article? Is it something that is conceptually distinct from the Casimir effect? Utopes seems to think so. —Quondum 12:09, 26 October 2024 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20241026120900","author":"Quondum","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-Quondum-20241026120900-Casimir_pressure","replies":["c-Ldm1954-20241026150800-Quondum-20241026120900","c-ReyHahn-20241026151800-Quondum-20241026120900","c-Johnjbarton-20241026161800-Quondum-20241026120900","c-Utopes-20241026200000-Quondum-20241026120900","c-Quondum-20241026231100-Quondum-20241026120900"]}}-->
- The main figure of Casimir effect has in the caption "Casimir force", which does question a difference. In addition a strange reference has been added of what might be an interesting paper on dark matter, but is too soon. Since you did a delete/redirect in March 2023 I suggest going to a RfD or similar. Ldm1954 (talk) 15:08, 26 October 2024 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20241026150800","author":"Ldm1954","type":"comment","level":2,"id":"c-Ldm1954-20241026150800-Quondum-20241026120900","replies":[]}}-->
- Speedy merge: Casimir force is by definition a pressure calculation, you get a force per unit area unless you multiply by the surface of the plates. I do not think it deserves a separate article. Casimir pressure has a single reference to a not cited paper that is on hypothetical dark matter particles, not notable.--ReyHahn (talk) 15:18, 26 October 2024 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20241026151800","author":"ReyHahn","type":"comment","level":2,"id":"c-ReyHahn-20241026151800-Quondum-20241026120900","replies":["c-Ldm1954-20241026152700-ReyHahn-20241026151800","c-Utopes-20241026200400-ReyHahn-20241026151800"]}}-->
- Note that @Quondum did a merge that was reverted, so it has (I believe) to go to discussion. Ldm1954 (talk) 15:27, 26 October 2024 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20241026152700","author":"Ldm1954","type":"comment","level":3,"id":"c-Ldm1954-20241026152700-ReyHahn-20241026151800","replies":[]}}-->
- @ReyHahn: I added that citation yesterday because the article (previously) existed as an unreferenced page since 2009-2023, and was WP:BLAR'd because Wikipedia is WP:NOTDICT. I agree. But the article shouldn't be BLAR'd into a page where the topic isn't discussed either, so alternative means should have been used when dealing with this page, and I was reverting the BLAR. In order to not have it pop up on the unreferenced-pages again though, I added a citation to a journal where Casimir pressure was discussed, as it seemed. I don't feel strongly about the reference, but figured it was better than no reference at all. Utopes (talk / cont) 20:04, 26 October 2024 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20241026200400","author":"Utopes","type":"comment","level":3,"id":"c-Utopes-20241026200400-ReyHahn-20241026151800","replies":["c-ReyHahn-20241026201500-Utopes-20241026200400"]}}-->
- @Utopes: Thanks for clarifying. I think that you are right, I will proceed to merge Casimir pressure content into Casimir force and redirect it. Would that be ok?--ReyHahn (talk) 20:15, 26 October 2024 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20241026201500","author":"ReyHahn","type":"comment","level":4,"id":"c-ReyHahn-20241026201500-Utopes-20241026200400","replies":["c-Utopes-20241026202000-ReyHahn-20241026201500","c-Ldm1954-20241026211500-ReyHahn-20241026201500"]}}-->
- That would be fine. The best thing to do (from my POV) would be to have the redirect point to an anchor at the target page, so that people who type in Casimir pressure are taken to the section in Casimir effect where "Casimir pressure" would be discussed. Thank you for the help! Utopes (talk / cont) 20:20, 26 October 2024 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20241026202000","author":"Utopes","type":"comment","level":5,"id":"c-Utopes-20241026202000-ReyHahn-20241026201500","replies":[]}}-->
- I just did the merge, adding in the lead two well cited papers that use the term interchangeable with effect. Ldm1954 (talk) 21:15, 26 October 2024 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20241026211500","author":"Ldm1954","type":"comment","level":5,"id":"c-Ldm1954-20241026211500-ReyHahn-20241026201500","replies":["c-Utopes-20241026212100-Ldm1954-20241026211500"]}}-->
- Thank you! Noting the term in the lead is definitely suitable, so targeting to the full page works here. Utopes (talk / cont) 21:21, 26 October 2024 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20241026212100","author":"Utopes","type":"comment","level":6,"id":"c-Utopes-20241026212100-Ldm1954-20241026211500","replies":[]}}-->
- I encourage editors to post on Talk:Casimir pressure to avoid excluding editors interested in that topic. Johnjbarton (talk) 16:18, 26 October 2024 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20241026161800","author":"Johnjbarton","type":"comment","level":2,"id":"c-Johnjbarton-20241026161800-Quondum-20241026120900","replies":[]}}-->
- WP:BLAR'ing the article into a title that doesn't mention "Casimir pressure" in the slightest (with the only mention of "pressure" being a reference to "producing 1 atm of pressure") is an inappropriate way of redirecting/removing content, Quondum. I don't have a strong opinion whether or not the page should exist, just that it should not be redirected to Casimir effect in the latter article's current state, where reader's questions about a "Casimir pressure" are not answered or addressed. Take to AfD if you must, or merge content to substantiate a redirect if desired. @Ldm1954:, there was no merge. No edits to Casimir effect by Quondum since 2022, and the BLAR occurred in 2023. Utopes (talk / cont) 20:00, 26 October 2024 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20241026200000","author":"Utopes","type":"comment","level":2,"id":"c-Utopes-20241026200000-Quondum-20241026120900","replies":[]}}-->
- Thanks all – this seems to have led to a good result. On my side, I should have just pointed to the talk page here and started the discussion there. It always helps to have people who a comfortable with the subject matter involved. —Quondum 23:11, 26 October 2024 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20241026231100","author":"Quondum","type":"comment","level":2,"id":"c-Quondum-20241026231100-Quondum-20241026120900","replies":[]}}-->
Can you believe that 20 years in, we have had no article on the concept of an object being sharp, in the sense of being able to initiate cuts through other surfaces?
I have started Sharpness (cutting), but it currently has more geology and biology than physics, and it could probably benefit from the does of the latter. I understand that there exist formulae for defining sharpness as inversely proportional to an edge radius, but this is not my field, so I defer to the experts to write further on that aspect. Cheers! BD2412 T 13:49, 27 October 2024 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20241027134900","author":"BD2412","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-BD2412-20241027134900-Sharpness_(cutting)","replies":[]}}-->
A newly created {{Infobox interpretation of quantum mechanics}} has been added. I am opposed to adding it to articles. Please comment here: Template_talk:Infobox_interpretation_of_quantum_mechanics#Interpretations_of_quantum_mechanics_cannot_be_summarized_in_yes_no_questions. Johnjbarton (talk) 16:00, 28 October 2024 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20241028160000","author":"Johnjbarton","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-Johnjbarton-20241028160000-Template:Infobox_interpretation_of_quantum_mechanics","replies":[]}}-->
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