Currently Plimer's directorships are referenced to newspaper articles. Is it better to reference the directly to the company pages? Kefi Minerals and Ivanhoe Resources. For CBH Resources, it appears they have been delisted and that Plimer is no longer a director. I can't find an announcement of his resignation though. I also find that The Barrier Daily Truth, a publication of some renown I'm sure, still shows him as "CBH Resources’ Professor Ian Plimer". --Thepm (talk) 08:37, 12 April 2011 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2011-04-12T08:37:00.000Z","author":"Thepm","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-Thepm-2011-04-12T08:37:00.000Z-Business_Interests","replies":["c-Tillman-2011-04-12T21:23:00.000Z-Thepm-2011-04-12T08:37:00.000Z"]}}-->
We had consensus to remove the mention of Monbiot from the section on Heaven and Earth (albiet with PS's dissent). The remaining question is whether we mention Monbiot at all. I tend to side with Pete Tillman that the Monbiot business was fairly peripheral although I'm open to being convinced otherwise.
I certainly would not agree that is "makes up a notable event in Plimer's life". At best I would think a passing mention would be sufficient. PS - can you suggest what you would like to see? --Thepm (talk) 03:12, 13 April 2011 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2011-04-13T03:12:00.000Z","author":"Thepm","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-Thepm-2011-04-13T03:12:00.000Z-Mention_of_George_Monbiot_debate_with_Ian_Plimer","replies":["c-Percival_Scion-2011-04-14T00:23:00.000Z-Thepm-2011-04-13T03:12:00.000Z"]}}-->
The fact remains that the debate with Monbiot was extensively covered in the media in Australia, so it is not insignificant and certainly makes up a notable event in Plimer's life. Period. As for "bestseller", that's a meaningless promotional word that needs to be qualified as to the source, if used. It certainly shouldn't be stated in wikipedia's voice, as if it's a fact. The sources claiming it are the publisher (no surprises there), and the conservative Australian press (again, not surprising). The ABC quote looks like lazy journalism, reading from supplied text. Why not attempt to find out actual sales figures from Nielsen, or some other source? I've read the book and it's well-nigh unreadable, so I'd be very surprised if it's truly popular. Unfortunately, the book industry treats sales information as proprietary, so any claims of "bestseller" is usually sourced to the publisher. The fact that the book was on the Australian Bookdata bestseller list for a short while, according to the publisher, is no huge feat .. but please note that some commentators are raising profound doubts about the claimed Bookdata statistics see here (this is a RS bec. the author is an expert in his field). Percival Scion (talk) 01:21, 13 April 2011 (UTC) (moved here by Thepm for continuity)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2011-04-13T01:21:00.000Z","author":"Percival Scion","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-Percival_Scion-2011-04-13T01:21:00.000Z-Heaven_and_Earth_(Book)_section_in_Plimer's_BLP.","replies":["c-Thepm-2011-04-13T03:29:00.000Z-Percival_Scion-2011-04-13T01:21:00.000Z"]}}-->
As Plimer is noted for his skepticism, there should be sections in this article addressing his criticisms and not just pointing out the fact that he is a skeptic... Just like Kant being known for a philosophy, gets a section on his philosophy. I suggest renaming putting both creationism and climate change views under Works and a summary of his arguments can be given in the intro (since criticism of climate change is his primary claim to fame) and in the overview of his works. Also suggest collapsing affiliation/business career and early life in career, into a Career section. Perhaps with subsections if necessary. --Shadowy Sorcerer (talk) 00:26, 6 December 2011 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2011-12-06T00:26:00.000Z","author":"Shadowy Sorcerer","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-Shadowy_Sorcerer-2011-12-06T00:26:00.000Z-Sections_for_His_Arguments","replies":[]}}-->
In regard to the statement "He has been a staunch critic of creationism in Australia but it it is his critique of global warming science that has brought him international fame.", I tagged it as needing a citation as that last claim - that he achieved international fame as a result of his stance - seems a bit POV and overly strong. He did get a degree of international recognition, but whether or not that constitutes fame is a different matter. It was suggested that we use the Lateline debate with Monbiot as a source, [2], but that doesn't ascribe fame to Plimer, only to Monbiot. ("Monbiot is a renowned champion of climate science.") I think we'll need something a bit stronger to support the Plimer claim. - Bilby (talk) 01:05, 6 December 2011 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2011-12-06T01:05:00.000Z","author":"Bilby","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-Bilby-2011-12-06T01:05:00.000Z-International_fame","replies":["c-Shadowy_Sorcerer-2011-12-06T01:29:00.000Z-Bilby-2011-12-06T01:05:00.000Z"]}}-->
I think it is worth noting Plimer's work as a skeptic fighting the creationists earlier, and also noting that :
- He has the mineral Plimerite - ZnFe4(PO4)3(OH)3 orthorhombic - named after him. - Plimer was named ‘Australian Humanist of the Year’ in 1995. - was president of the Australian Geoscience Council - Plimer is the Patron of Lifeline (Broken Hill) & Patron of the Broken Hill Geocentre. - Plimer is a regular communicator / populariser of science esp. geology and skepticism to the public via radio, print & TV.
Source : Page 4 ("About the Author") "Heaven & Earth", Connor Court, 2009. StevoR 124.182.226.16 (talk)
Media articles discussing Plimer often say "..has published over 120 scientific papers.." or very similar, as here. This figure of > 120 has no foundation in fact: the ISI Web of Science lists 59 publications, and Elesevier's Scopus lists 68. Whilst either index can miss some things they are both close to comprehensive and it is inconceivable they could be out by a factor of two (in fact they can overstate by including conference abstracts and editorial content). Where are the other 60 or more publications? No list is ever given, anywhere. ISI give Plimer an H-index of 14 from 661 citations, and Scopus a post-1995 H index of 6. These figures are very low for a full professor of an Australian University. It is possible to see a basic summary of the Scopus data without paying for a subscription, or if you are on a university network connection you may instead be shown the full version: http://www.scopus.com/authid/detail.url?authorId=7003490388. 122.107.167.14 (talk) 12:54, 20 May 2013 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2013-05-20T12:54:00.000Z","author":"122.107.167.14","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-122.107.167.14-2013-05-20T12:54:00.000Z-Plimer's_publications","replies":["c-Sminthopsis84-2013-05-20T16:55:00.000Z-122.107.167.14-2013-05-20T12:54:00.000Z"]}}-->
We do not "count articles" per WP:OR so using "many" seems the simplest solution. Couunting up to six, however, is simple, and should not need a citation. Collect (talk) 17:43, 20 May 2013 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2013-05-20T17:43:00.000Z","author":"Collect","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-Collect-2013-05-20T17:43:00.000Z-Plimer's_publications","replies":[]}}-->
Tillman reverted my section headings edit stating that they are contentious and lack citation. Stating that something is contentious does not mean that it is contentious. The first section heading I edited had the utterly meaningless label "climate change skepticism" which can mean scientific skepticism or global warming denial or anything in between. It is an overloaded term with multiple meanings (sometimes considered to be pejorative) and a section heading should accurately represent the material in the section it heads. What is contentious about "rejection of climate science"? The second edit was to provide a new section heading for the second paragraph describing conspiracy theories under the "political influence" section. Since that paragraph is about conspiracy theories and not political influence, I added a new heading to accurately describe the paragraph. Finally, I do not understand why Tillman says these headings need citations. None of the other headings in the article, including the ones I replaced, have citations and I don't think it is customary to put citations on headings. IHaveAMastersDegree (talk) 13:50, 2 January 2014 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2014-01-02T13:50:00.000Z","author":"IHaveAMastersDegree","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-IHaveAMastersDegree-2014-01-02T13:50:00.000Z-Section_headings","replies":["c-Collect-2014-01-02T15:16:00.000Z-IHaveAMastersDegree-2014-01-02T13:50:00.000Z"]}}-->
User:IHaveAMastersDegree persistently ignores the dictionary meaning of skeptic and replaces it with a variety of words, sometimes pejorative, sometimes unsourced. I have complained on the Administrators Noticeboard which resulted in an "ARBCC notification" on IHaveAMasterDegree's talk page but he/she persists and is currently editing articles many times per day, (watch https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:Contributions/IHaveAMastersDegree). I am not engaging with him/her here, just warning about what's going on. Peter Gulutzan (talk) 16:25, 2 January 2014 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2014-01-02T16:25:00.000Z","author":"Peter Gulutzan","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-Peter_Gulutzan-2014-01-02T16:25:00.000Z-Section_headings","replies":["c-IHaveAMastersDegree-2014-01-02T16:49:00.000Z-Peter_Gulutzan-2014-01-02T16:25:00.000Z","c-IHaveAMastersDegree-2014-01-02T17:05:00.000Z-Peter_Gulutzan-2014-01-02T16:25:00.000Z"]}}-->
Update: IHaveAMastersDegree has now been blocked. Peter Gulutzan (talk) 19:20, 19 January 2014 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2014-01-19T19:20:00.000Z","author":"Peter Gulutzan","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-Peter_Gulutzan-2014-01-19T19:20:00.000Z-Section_headings","replies":[]}}-->
An article by a volcanologist at Live Science says that the most recent estimate of volcanic outgassing is 600 million tons/ year, a 6x increase over previous estimates. The author notes that actual data on this is scarce. So Plimer may have a point, though even the largest estimates of Volcanic CO2 are still far less than humans. --Pete Tillman (talk) 16:29, 4 July 2014 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2014-07-04T16:29:00.000Z","author":"Tillman","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-Tillman-2014-07-04T16:29:00.000Z-Volcanoes_and_CO2","replies":["c-Dave_souza-2014-07-04T16:56:00.000Z-Tillman-2014-07-04T16:29:00.000Z","c-Zero0000-2015-03-02T13:58:00.000Z-Tillman-2014-07-04T16:29:00.000Z"],"displayName":"Pete Tillman"}}-->
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"He has been an outspoken critic of both creationism and the scientific consensus on anthropogenic climate change."
Am I the only one who finds this sentence a bit unsightly? Plimer is pro-science regarding one subject (which, for a scientist, is only remarkable because he has written a lot about it) and anti-science regarding another (which, for a scientist, is remarkable and puts him in Category:Weirdo). The article is doing the splits in one sentence. I don't think those two properties should be grammatically joined in this way. --Hob Gadling (talk) 13:00, 1 October 2015 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2015-10-01T13:00:00.000Z","author":"Hob Gadling","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-Hob_Gadling-2015-10-01T13:00:00.000Z-Creationism_and_climate_change_denial","replies":["c-Peter_Gulutzan-2015-10-01T15:44:00.000Z-Hob_Gadling-2015-10-01T13:00:00.000Z","c-Ashmoo-2015-10-02T11:30:00.000Z-Hob_Gadling-2015-10-01T13:00:00.000Z"]}}-->
Section = 109 BLP articles labelled "Climate Change Deniers" all at once. This article was placed in a "climate change deniers" category. After discussion on WP:BLPN and WP:CFD the category was deleted. Peter Gulutzan (talk) 17:16, 20 December 2015 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2015-12-20T17:16:00.000Z","author":"Peter Gulutzan","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-Peter_Gulutzan-2015-12-20T17:16:00.000Z-BLP_noticeboard","replies":[]}}-->
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This article is about Dr Plimer, not about climate change. The section on Volcanoes and CO2 goes beyond saying "his views on the matter have been refuted" into something else. The line about the EPA is relevant as it refutes him, the others are original research or irrelevant. --Richardson mcphillips (talk) 18:48, 26 November 2017 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2017-11-26T18:48:00.000Z","author":"Richardson mcphillips","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-Richardson_mcphillips-2017-11-26T18:48:00.000Z-Volcanoes_and_CO2_2","replies":["c-Dave_souza-2017-11-26T19:15:00.000Z-Richardson_mcphillips-2017-11-26T18:48:00.000Z"]}}-->
Yet on Donald Prothero's page it does not say other scientists such as Plimer looked at the same data and reached a different conclusion. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.224.251.239 (talk) 20:24, 17 April 2019 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2019-04-17T20:24:00.000Z","author":"71.224.251.239","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-71.224.251.239-2019-04-17T20:24:00.000Z-Other_scientists,_such_as_Donald_Prothero_another_geologist,_have_reviewed_simil","replies":["c-Guettarda-2019-04-17T21:57:00.000Z-71.224.251.239-2019-04-17T20:24:00.000Z"]}}-->
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