This is an archive of past discussions with User:Bkonrad. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page.

I notice that an obstructionist is trying to destroy the Mike Cox wikipedia entry information and that you keep fixing it. Thank you! How do you know to do that? Do you work for wikipedia? Do you know who this obstructionist is? Adambradford82 I think you maybe even had to do it again today? I think the information and links that you put back are very informative... THanks Again! Please don't give up. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Billyjoeyjimmybobby (talk • contribs) 19:13, 2 November 2009 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2009-11-02T19:13:00.000Z","author":"Billyjoeyjimmybobby","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-Billyjoeyjimmybobby-2009-11-02T19:13:00.000Z-Thank_you_for_your_work_with_the_Mike_Cox_Page","replies":[]}}-->

Please do not move pages by copying and pasting the content as with The Beach Hotel --> Beach Hotel (Galveston), Beach Hotel --> Beach Hotel (Sydney); and Clear Lake --> Clear Lake (California). Under terms of the license Wikipedia uses, it is important to keep the edit history with the associated pages and copy and paste moves disrupt that connection. Please use the Move function to move a page with the edit history intact. If you are not able to move a page (perhaps because an admin is needed for particular moves) or if the move might be controversial, please follow the instructions at WP:Requested moves. older ≠ wiser 22:05, 5 November 2009 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2009-11-05T22:05:00.000Z","author":"Bkonrad","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-Bkonrad-2009-11-05T22:05:00.000Z-copy_and_paste_moves","replies":["c-Mcorazao-2009-11-06T01:21:00.000Z-Bkonrad-2009-11-05T22:05:00.000Z"],"displayName":"older"}}-->

Ah, thanks. I was not aware of the procedure. I'll look at the procedure. --Mcorazao (talk) 01:21, 6 November 2009 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2009-11-06T01:21:00.000Z","author":"Mcorazao","type":"comment","level":2,"id":"c-Mcorazao-2009-11-06T01:21:00.000Z-Bkonrad-2009-11-05T22:05:00.000Z","replies":[]}}-->

Hi,

You removed my above edit, I've added it back in and added a reference to the name on the main Baseball Ground page. Hope that's ok.

Martyn. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 193.195.73.210 (talk) 10:59, 19 November 2009 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2009-11-19T10:59:00.000Z","author":"193.195.73.210","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-193.195.73.210-2009-11-19T10:59:00.000Z-Re-added_Baseball_Ground_link_on_BBG_page.","replies":[]}}-->

"I reverted your cleanup on this article. The reason I did so while yours does look grammatically better there were sources on there that covered you citation needed and describexd the article itself. Caan we figure a way to do both so we are both happy? Hell In A Bucket (talk) 22:33, 21 November 2009 (UTC)"

My sources say "In 1940, the City Commissioner of Parks and Highways arranged for Pueblo Public Park District No. 2 to purchase C.W. Parker #72. The ride was installed south and east of Goodnight Avenue; however it lacked a building to protect it at this point"[[1]] and from the City Park Site itself, under restoration [[2]]. I tried several different ways and whatever I do he has said it's not enough. Yes I'm freaking pissed right now. Please read the sources and consider what you see. Hell In A Bucket (talk) 00:06, 22 November 2009 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2009-11-22T00:06:00.000Z","author":"Hell in a Bucket","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-Hell_in_a_Bucket-2009-11-22T00:06:00.000Z-Look_at_the_History.","replies":["c-Hell_in_a_Bucket-2009-11-22T00:31:00.000Z-Hell_in_a_Bucket-2009-11-22T00:06:00.000Z"]}}-->

It's amazing how none of you people would even look at my sources that have been on the article since the other dude got there. Perhaps you can explain your ani comments how I wouldn't provide sources.I've went out of my way to provide my soources. Can someone please comment on that? Hell In A Bucket (talk) 00:31, 22 November 2009 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2009-11-22T00:31:00.000Z","author":"Hell in a Bucket","type":"comment","level":2,"id":"c-Hell_in_a_Bucket-2009-11-22T00:31:00.000Z-Hell_in_a_Bucket-2009-11-22T00:06:00.000Z","replies":[]}}-->

Please do not change Ortonvilles page any more as a teacher i changed so my students wont use this site which i told them not too. Thank You. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Zduff14 (talk • contribs) 14:58, 24 November 2009 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2009-11-24T14:58:00.000Z","author":"Zduff14","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-Zduff14-2009-11-24T14:58:00.000Z-Ortonville,Michigan","replies":[]}}-->

I am working to clean up a lot of links that are sending people to the wrong places.

The Marcellus, Michigan, pages does not reflect the proper name, that I why I have moved it twice. In Michigan there is a Marcellus Village and a township. These are two different types of government, and areas.

This is no different than the Marcellus (town) in New York, and Marcellus (village) in New York.

• Marcellus (town), New York
  • Marcellus (village), New York

Several location have similar names, Thus the need to mark the need to highlight which is which.

Change Marcellus, Michigan to reflect the correct name Marcellus (village), Michigan is moving it to the proper naming convention.

Thank you for understanding the need to correct this problem, and leave them as the proper names to reflect the current form of government and geographic areas. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Jsgoodrich (talk • contribs) 22:12, 5 December 2009 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2009-12-05T22:12:00.000Z","author":"Jsgoodrich","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-Jsgoodrich-2009-12-05T22:12:00.000Z-Marcellus,_Michigan_(Township_vs_Village)","replies":["c-Bkonrad-2009-12-05T22:20:00.000Z-Jsgoodrich-2009-12-05T22:12:00.000Z"]}}-->

The naming conventions for places in New York is distinct from that used in Michigan (and most other states with the exception of Wisconsin and a few New England states). Towns and Villages in those state may have the same name and require disambiguation. In Michigan, the word "township" is commonly used as a part of the name and forms natural disambiguation between the entities. Unless you have evidence from reliable sources that the township is currently, commonly known as simply "Marcellus, Michigan", I don't see any need to rename the village article. Village articles in Michigan are not disambiguated in that way, including those villages that have the same name as the township in which they are located. older ≠ wiser 22:20, 5 December 2009 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2009-12-05T22:20:00.000Z","author":"Bkonrad","type":"comment","level":2,"id":"c-Bkonrad-2009-12-05T22:20:00.000Z-Jsgoodrich-2009-12-05T22:12:00.000Z","replies":[],"displayName":"older"}}-->

I agree with some of what you said, but New York's Towns are the same as Township's in Michigan. There have several articles that have been pointing, at stuff for the township, that have been directed to the village. Not just on wiki, but on third party cite's. Even the disambiguation page did not list the township. As I work to add more information on Cass and St. Joseph County I am trying to build these pages up. I am doing a history project on the area and a lot of older information does not highlight the difference between these areas. It really sucks. One of the other things I have found is in the older records towns went away, and just became townships. This happen with the town of Mason, which is just Mason Township in Cass county. This also happened to Mottville, in St. joe, Michigan.

Having been a resident of both Michigan and New York, they are both used to highlight the differences in New York most people call it the town of Marcellus, of the Village of Marcellus. This is the same for Marcellus in Michigan. Also both Marcellus Township and Village share the same zip code and phone exchange. So when people refer to Marcellus, they are sending people to the Village page, and not to where the item is located, which is in the township. Jsgoodrich (talk) 22:39, 5 December 2009 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2009-12-05T22:39:00.000Z","author":"Jsgoodrich","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-Jsgoodrich-2009-12-05T22:39:00.000Z-Marcellus,_Michigan_(Township_vs_Village)","replies":["c-Bkonrad-2009-12-05T22:45:00.000Z-Jsgoodrich-2009-12-05T22:39:00.000Z"]}}-->

The naming conventions used on Wikipedia are different. Compare Category:Villages in Michigan with Category:Villages in New York. No other village in Michigan is disambiguated by adding "(village)" into the name, although many have the same name as the township in which they are located. For townships in Michigan, "Township" is considered to be part of the name and forms a natural disambiguation with any villages (or cities) that might have the same name. In New York, this is not the case. older ≠ wiser 22:45, 5 December 2009 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2009-12-05T22:45:00.000Z","author":"Bkonrad","type":"comment","level":2,"id":"c-Bkonrad-2009-12-05T22:45:00.000Z-Jsgoodrich-2009-12-05T22:39:00.000Z","replies":[],"displayName":"older"}}-->

Again, what is there your are correct, however the problem becomes, that articles are not reflecting the proper location, nor are third party sites. One example is the "Marcellus Library" Which is located in the Village of Marcellus, but the official name is the Marcellus Township Wood Memorial Library. [[3]] The other is the Marcellus Cemetery, which is located in the Marcellus Township not in the village. The Cemetery is also known as Bly Cemetery.

The Village calls everything "Village of Marcellus" so the DPW is the Village of Marcellus Department of Public Works. The Village of Marcellus Council. Here is just one example of the Webster-online-dictionary not m-w and off shoot which does not even list the township. [[4]]

Here is just another example of the township being talked about and not the village. [[5]] Howardsville Christian School is in the township of Marcellus and not the village. [[6]]

When people send mail to the village of Marcellus or the township of Marcellus, they send it to Marcellus, MI 49067. So other sites think it is all one. The Village however is much smaller. So when people come to wiki to look up Marcellus, MI the find the village page, not the township page. Some one visiting looked up the bar Melvilles out at fish lake 14625 Loveridge Street, Marcellus, MI‎ . It highlight Marcellus, MI. Not the township. I do have to admit that my reason also works against me, because there is no line between Village of Marcellus mail either.

I can not state what the other cities and village separate themselves int he state. To me it looks more like a problem with how the Villages and Township were setup in WIki. Which I think should be looked at, how every right now, I am trying to add more to Cass and St. Joe right now, not the whole state, as this area of Michigan is in a large part dying When the 2010 census comes out I think the populations will drop in these areas, as the early data is showing.

The village and township are different. The people in the Village call it the Village of Marcellus, and the Township is Marcellus. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Jsgoodrich (talk • contribs) 23:13, 5 December 2009 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2009-12-05T23:13:00.000Z","author":"Jsgoodrich","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-Jsgoodrich-2009-12-05T23:13:00.000Z-Marcellus,_Michigan_(Township_vs_Village)","replies":[]}}-->

Here is a link to a site quote wiki [[7]] That is the post office for the whole township, not the just the village. But it is only called the Marcellus Post office. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Jsgoodrich (talk • contribs) 23:24, 5 December 2009 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2009-12-05T23:24:00.000Z","author":"Jsgoodrich","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-Jsgoodrich-2009-12-05T23:24:00.000Z-Marcellus,_Michigan_(Township_vs_Village)","replies":["c-Bkonrad-2009-12-05T23:31:00.000Z-Jsgoodrich-2009-12-05T23:24:00.000Z"]}}-->

Of course the village and township are different. But how does it help to name the article about this village differently than all the other similar villages in Michigan? The sort of confusion you mention is relatively common, but has not seemed to cause much confusion either in the Michigan articles, or in any of the other states with township and village governments. For example, in many cases, the township offices are often located in the village. The post office in fact serves not only most (but not all) of the township, but portions of townships to the north, east, south and west, so it is misleading to represent it as the post office for Marcellus township. I think there needs to be a much stronger case for making this one village article different from all the other similar villages. older ≠ wiser 23:31, 5 December 2009 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2009-12-05T23:31:00.000Z","author":"Bkonrad","type":"comment","level":2,"id":"c-Bkonrad-2009-12-05T23:31:00.000Z-Jsgoodrich-2009-12-05T23:24:00.000Z","replies":[],"displayName":"older"}}-->

Agian I agree, that it sucks that this villiage will break the trend with what is normally on Wiki. On Wiki there is no question, but if the idea of wiki is to make for people to use. Then sometimes we have to think outside our normall mode and look at how people are citing and using it. This is a document from the state of Miching which list the official names for all Incorporated, Township, and Uninvorporated areas in the state [8] In it you will find the offical names are Marcellus Villiage and Marcellus Township. I think how the towns in Michigan are listed in Michigan cause problems for anyone using it.

Also on the Michigan WikiProject Site it even highlights the problem with the names of these towns and townships and unincorporated communites. "There are countless unincorporated communities that have the same name as their township and should probably be made into a redirect (with a note in the township article). At present, most stubby articles on unincorporated communities can be merged into their township articles."

The problem is that the Villiage is not a stubby article and it is incoprated. I think wiki has it standardized just in a way that wors for wiki not in way that works for people using it. That becomes the problem. Jsgoodrich (talk) 23:47, 5 December 2009 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2009-12-05T23:47:00.000Z","author":"Jsgoodrich","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-Jsgoodrich-2009-12-05T23:47:00.000Z-Marcellus,_Michigan_(Township_vs_Village)","replies":["c-Bkonrad-2009-12-06T00:22:00.000Z-Jsgoodrich-2009-12-05T23:47:00.000Z"]}}-->

As I said, I think you'll need to make a much stronger case than anything you've said so far. older ≠ wiser 00:22, 6 December 2009 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2009-12-06T00:22:00.000Z","author":"Bkonrad","type":"comment","level":2,"id":"c-Bkonrad-2009-12-06T00:22:00.000Z-Jsgoodrich-2009-12-05T23:47:00.000Z","replies":[],"displayName":"older"}}-->

Would like to add next generation section to this article that would not be COI. Will provide references and citations in new sections. Next Generations of Living Machines would appear in content block.

Would also like to insert the Eco Machine and its factual information. (Jean Scheid (talk) 17:38, 8 December 2009 (UTC))__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2009-12-08T17:38:00.000Z","author":"Jean Scheid","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-Jean_Scheid-2009-12-08T17:38:00.000Z-Adding_new_section_to_Living_Machines","replies":[]}}-->

Hi Bkonrad- I saw you removed most of the internal links from the Kale_(disambiguation) page so that there was only one blue like per line.I was under the impression that is was more of a "rule-of thumb" that included some wiggle room, as apposed to a hard and fast rule. Even the Main_Page has more than one link per line in some cases. I think it makes sense to have an internal link for Romani in this case as it is a group that not all people are familiar with. I look forward to your response. AJseagull1 (talk) 01:07, 11 December 2009 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2009-12-11T01:07:00.000Z","author":"AJseagull1","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-AJseagull1-2009-12-11T01:07:00.000Z-One_Blue_link_per_line_re:Kale","replies":["c-Bkonrad-2009-12-11T01:14:00.000Z-AJseagull1-2009-12-11T01:07:00.000Z"]}}-->

The Main page is not a disambiguation page. The style and format of disambiguation pages is found at WP:MOSDAB]. older ≠ wiser 01:14, 11 December 2009 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2009-12-11T01:14:00.000Z","author":"Bkonrad","type":"comment","level":2,"id":"c-Bkonrad-2009-12-11T01:14:00.000Z-AJseagull1-2009-12-11T01:07:00.000Z","replies":["c-AJseagull1-2009-12-11T01:23:00.000Z-Bkonrad-2009-12-11T01:14:00.000Z"],"displayName":"older"}}-->

ThanksAJseagull1 (talk) 01:23, 11 December 2009 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2009-12-11T01:23:00.000Z","author":"AJseagull1","type":"comment","level":4,"id":"c-AJseagull1-2009-12-11T01:23:00.000Z-Bkonrad-2009-12-11T01:14:00.000Z","replies":[]}}-->

I removed Hope, Michigan because I saw that it redirected to Hope Township, Midland County, Michigan, so I thought it was a previously mistakenly named page redirected to a township article properly covered by the Hope Township dab. I didn't see that the township article included a separate section discussing the unincorporated community. I have now added an anchor to the redirect so it goes to that section. Thanks for catching my oversight. Cheers!--ShelfSkewed Talk 04:49, 11 December 2009 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2009-12-11T04:49:00.000Z","author":"ShelfSkewed","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-ShelfSkewed-2009-12-11T04:49:00.000Z-Hope_(disambiguation)","replies":["c-Bkonrad-2009-12-11T13:41:00.000Z-ShelfSkewed-2009-12-11T04:49:00.000Z"]}}-->

No problem. Thanks for the note. older ≠ wiser 13:41, 11 December 2009 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2009-12-11T13:41:00.000Z","author":"Bkonrad","type":"comment","level":2,"id":"c-Bkonrad-2009-12-11T13:41:00.000Z-ShelfSkewed-2009-12-11T04:49:00.000Z","replies":[],"displayName":"older"}}-->

I don't understand where you're coming from by saying that the Bay is located on the south-west side of the UP. On the map it clearly looks south central to me, but I'd compromise to just say south (without saying west). Please explain your point on the talk page. Even better, find me a reliable source that says it has anything to do with the west coast. Royalbroil 00:52, 17 December 2009 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2009-12-17T00:52:00.000Z","author":"Royalbroil","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-Royalbroil-2009-12-17T00:52:00.000Z-Green_Bay_(Lake_Michigan)_location_within_Michigan","replies":[],"displayName":"Royal"}}-->

Redirects to articles in the German Wikipedia which do not have articles on the English Wikipedia are appropriate? Then let's all do a mass run over to the German Wikipedia and create edits which consist of nothing but red links that link to the English Wikipedia articles. Woogee (talk) 23:28, 19 December 2009 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2009-12-19T23:28:00.000Z","author":"Woogee","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-Woogee-2009-12-19T23:28:00.000Z-K\u00fcchl","replies":[]}}-->

Hawaii Territory was created in 1898, but it was not organized until 1900. Confusing, but Organized incorporated territories of the United States only lists organized and incorporated territories. - BilCat (talk) 16:20, 25 December 2009 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2009-12-25T16:20:00.000Z","author":"BilCat","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-BilCat-2009-12-25T16:20:00.000Z-Hawaii_Territory","replies":[]}}-->