Downsize43 (talk) 07:15, 22 October 2019 (UTC)[reply]__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2019-10-22T07:15:00.000Z","author":"Downsize43","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-Downsize43-2019-10-22T07:15:00.000Z-Chronological_order???","replies":["c-Buaidh-20240710101400-Downsize43-2019-10-22T07:15:00.000Z"]}}-->
Chronological order means in birth order, i.e., oldest to youngest. Buaidh talke-mail10:14, 10 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20240710101400","author":"Buaidh","type":"comment","level":2,"id":"c-Buaidh-20240710101400-Downsize43-2019-10-22T07:15:00.000Z","replies":[]}}-->
Open membership in this project to users who are at least 60 years of age and have made at least 50 edits in the past year.[b]
Open supporting membership in this project to users who are less than 60 years old but have made at least 50 edits in the past year and support the goals of this project.[c]
Suggested goals for this project:
To support collaboration and communication among members for the advancement and improvement of Wikipedia and the Wikimedia movement.
To encourage older people, retired people, and soon-to-be-retired people to participate in Wikipedia both for the advancement of the encyclopedia and for their own personal enjoyment.
To encourage older people to share their experience and expertise for the improvement of Wikipedia.
To encourage older users to use their experience and expertise to help younger and less experienced users.
To encourage participation in local and regional Wikimedia events.
To sponsor Wikipedia meetings and classes at places where older people gather.
To advocate for the elimination of ageism and sexism in Wikipedia and the Wikimedia movement.
^This current minimum age limit of this project is 70 years. A minimum age limit of 60 years should permit the participation of most retired users. The minimum activity level of 50 edits per year is arbitrary. A minimum activity level indicates continued interest. Members who do not meet the minimum activity level shall be moved to inactive status. Members who have died shall be moved to memorial status.
^A new class of Supporting Members allows those users under 60 years to support the goals of the project. Users approaching the age of 60 years may wish to become supporting members in anticipation of reaching the minimum age limit for members.
Please add your suggestions for this project at Senior Wikipedians. Thank you, Buaidh talke-mail01:15, 10 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20240710011500","author":"Buaidh","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-Buaidh-20240710011500-Senior_Wikipedians","replies":[]}}-->
If you don't wish to receive any further information about Senior Wikipedians, please remove your username from our notice list. Thanks.
I suggest that "Senior" should be avoided, as it's ambiguous between chronological seniority and some kind of power ranking. We could just be non-euphemistic and talk about "Older Wikipedians"?
This group seems to have had a low profile, as I'd never heard of it until spotting a note on a user talk page which is on my watchlist for some historical reason. Perhaps the Signpost would be a good place to raise its profile? PamD14:33, 10 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20240710143300","author":"PamD","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-PamD-20240710143300-Senior_Wikipedians","replies":["c-Bduke-20240713035100-PamD-20240710143300"],"displayName":"Pam"}}-->
I suggest that this page should be deleted. All Wikipedians are equal. I am 85. Why do you want to treat me different from any other Wikipedian? Bduke (talk) 03:51, 13 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20240713035100","author":"Bduke","type":"comment","level":2,"id":"c-Bduke-20240713035100-PamD-20240710143300","replies":["c-Buaidh-20240714050600-Bduke-20240713035100","c-Buster7-20240725022100-Bduke-20240713035100"]}}-->
I'm only 76, but I've been the object of ageist harassment editing Wikipedia. It's not about treating users any differently. It's about encouraging older folks to use their expertise to improve Wikipedia. I think far too few people over 60 edit Wikipedia when many are retired and have the time. What do you think? Buaidh talke-mail05:06, 14 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20240714050600","author":"Buaidh","type":"comment","level":3,"id":"c-Buaidh-20240714050600-Bduke-20240713035100","replies":["c-Bduke-20240714054200-Buaidh-20240714050600","c-Donald_Albury-20240714134800-Buaidh-20240714050600"]}}-->
I am very sorry that you have been the object of ageist harassment editing Wikipedia. I have never been subjected to that. I entirely agree that we should have more older folks editing wikipedia, but we have to get them using computers first, so this has to be done at very local levels - old folks homes, etc. I actually now live in an old folks home, so I will see what I can do here. Bduke (talk) 05:42, 14 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20240714054200","author":"Bduke","type":"comment","level":4,"id":"c-Bduke-20240714054200-Buaidh-20240714050600","replies":[]}}-->
Well, I'm currently 80, and I was 78 when I was elected to ArbCom. Despite the clues I've left over the years, including the octogenarian userbox on my home page, I have never encountered any comment about my age on Wikipedia, whereas I began encountering age discrimination in the workplace before I was 50. As for needing to encouragen older people to use computers, my step-father was buying and selling on e-bay in his 90s, and my mother gave up researching genealogy on-line in her late 90s, when her eyesight got too bad. I have nothing against this project, but I don't spend a lot of time participating in the projects I have signed up for. Donald Albury13:48, 14 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20240714134800","author":"Donald Albury","type":"comment","level":4,"id":"c-Donald_Albury-20240714134800-Buaidh-20240714050600","replies":["c-Buaidh-20240724234500-Donald_Albury-20240714134800"]}}-->
Congratulations on all your accomplishments. You are far more respected than I am. Yours aye, Buaidh talke-mail23:45, 24 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20240724234500","author":"Buaidh","type":"comment","level":5,"id":"c-Buaidh-20240724234500-Donald_Albury-20240714134800","replies":[]}}-->
I agree that the title "Senior" conveys power more than chronological age. Having been here for 15 years I cannot recall a single act of of ageism in all that time. Unless we give clues, with our userboxes, we are all faceless strangers. I have had many Wikifriends that, thru personal Talk page conversations, were, I guess, over 50. Some told me they were retired. Sometimes, we shared our age, but just as a point of fact, a point of information. I always edit with a thesaurus nearby. Rather than Senior I suggest "Elder" which conveys experience, perhaps a bit of status, but nothing not deserved, with no social weight other than respect. Buster Seven Talk (UTC) 02:21, 25 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20240725022100","author":"Buster7","type":"comment","level":3,"id":"c-Buster7-20240725022100-Bduke-20240713035100","replies":["c-Buster7-20240725120800-Buster7-20240725022100"],"displayName":"Buster Seven"}}-->
After sleeping on it and discussing it with my "even older" wife I think "The Elders" describes us best. It conveys time spent learning. Time invested in a thing...in this case...Living. Buster Seven Talk (UTC) 12:08, 25 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20240725120800","author":"Buster7","type":"comment","level":4,"id":"c-Buster7-20240725120800-Buster7-20240725022100","replies":[],"displayName":"Buster Seven"}}-->
I vote for keeping the grouping as is: "Wikipedians aged 70 and older". Don't want to include younger groups-- there could be reasons for wanting to limit a search to 'Wikipedians aged 70 and older'. 'Senior' has a couple of different meanings (e.g. a "senior advisor" could mean an advisor with experienced & superior knowledge, or it could mean an advisor who is a senior, or it could mean an advisor on seniors). Also, one becomes a 'senior' in different countries at different ages. Really dislike 'Elder'-- it sounds like a religious designation. 'Wikipedians aged 70 and older' is clear in meaning. SaturnCat (talk) 15:08, 28 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20240728150800","author":"SaturnCat","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-SaturnCat-20240728150800-Senior_Wikipedians","replies":["c-Buster7-20240729122000-SaturnCat-20240728150800"]}}-->
I see "Elder" more in the American Indian light--the guy that lights the peace pipe, that keeps the communal circle intact, that is the repository of the stories of the tribe. With all the talk about "to old to hold office" and ageism I think Senior does us a dis-service. The vast majority of WP editors are no doubt middle aged or younger. With senior comes "senior citizens". Doddering old people that need protective care. Elder conveys wisdom. It conveys custodians of knowledge by way of experience here at WP and in Real Life. But I am happy this group exists, under any name. Buster Seven Talk (UTC) 12:20, 29 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20240729122000","author":"Buster7","type":"comment","level":5,"id":"c-Buster7-20240729122000-SaturnCat-20240728150800","replies":[],"displayName":"Buster Seven"}}-->
Consensus: Our current project consensus is to keep our name WikiProject Wikipedians aged 70 and older and to continue to restrict our membership to users over 70 years old.
Unfortunately, our project remains largely inactive with only four current active members. For all intents, our project is merely a registry for those of us willing to admit that we are elderly. Hopefully, an influx of new, and perhaps more ambitious, septuagenarian users will reactivate this project.
Best wishes,
Buaidh talke-mail00:03, 7 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20240907000300","author":"Buaidh","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-Buaidh-20240907000300-Senior_Wikipedians","replies":["c-Buster7-20240907035900-Buaidh-20240907000300"]}}-->
It is quite obvious that what this project needs is some energetic 'young bloods" to wake us from our doldrums. After all, as the younger generation often tells us, "Age is just a number". If we could get just one really old veteran editor that is well-known and has a large following, we would increase our membership by 25%. We need to shake some trees and see what falls. Hopefully they won't get hurt by the landing. Or maybe they will get hurt and we can all commiserate over their injuries. Anything to get the wheel of participation rolling! As the Brits say...TRA! Elder Buster7 aka Buster Seven Talk (UTC) 03:59, 7 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20240907035900","author":"Buster7","type":"comment","level":3,"id":"c-Buster7-20240907035900-Buaidh-20240907000300","replies":["c-Buaidh-20241008015100-Buster7-20240907035900"],"displayName":"Buster Seven"}}-->
This is exactly why I think we need to drop our minimum age requirement to 60. I have a fatal disease, so there is a limit to how much more trouble I can stir up. Yours aye, Buaidh talke-mail01:51, 8 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20241008015100","author":"Buaidh","type":"comment","level":4,"id":"c-Buaidh-20241008015100-Buster7-20240907035900","replies":["c-Buster7-20241008122300-Buaidh-20241008015100"]}}-->
The debate among "The bearded ones" about what to call ourselves continues. Most prefer "Senior" as in Senior Care Facility or Senior discount. I prefer "Elder" as in "I have been here a while and I know what the FukImdoing. Now get off my lawn you little rugrats!", "Elder" demands respect. "Elder" says to all that are paying attention, "The mud at the bottom of my cloak has been achieved by slopping thru the droppings and bile of many a conflict but here I stand ready to defend my WP". "Elder" says, ""I may take a break under that Mighty Oak over there and I may fall asleep, and dream of days gone by, but I'm not dead". "Senior says, "I better call the cemetery and let them know I'm coming!" TRA! Best to you Buaidh!!! Hope you can enjoy my humor despite your situation. Buster Seven Talk (UTC) 12:23, 8 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20241008122300","author":"Buster7","type":"comment","level":5,"id":"c-Buster7-20241008122300-Buaidh-20241008015100","replies":[],"displayName":"Buster Seven"}}-->
My proposal to make extensive changes to WikiProject Wikipedians aged 70 and older was a bust, primarily because many users felt that the term "Senior Wikipedian" implied a higher ranking Wikipedia membership. Therefore, I am making two less ambitious proposals:
I don't know how to indent on here, but my input is to leave the name as is: 'Wikipedians aged 70 and older'. (And I like that graphic of the 18th century couple for the group.) I don't like 'Elder' cuz some religions (Mormons?/Quakers?) use Elder as a title, like 'Elder Smith'. I don't like the idea of including the 60-69 crowd b/c some of them (incl. me) consider that age bracket to still be middle-aged. To be honest, I don't think there should be any lobbying effort to try to get new members in the group. If people wanna edit Wiki, they can; & some people don't want to advertise their age. One thing that might help new Editors of any age are clearer 'how to' instructions on how to do things. E.g. Are responses to these paragraphs auto-indented (I'll see soon enuf), how to make User Boxes, etc. BTW, if someone wants to design a Barnstar for the 'Wikipedians aged 70 and older' group, it could be a bent & rusty Barnstar-- haha. (I am hoping someone will give me a Barnstar someday since I've done over 100 edits. I do mostly minor edits & am on the 'Typo Team'.) Thanks. SaturnCat (talk) 00:54, 12 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20241012005400","author":"SaturnCat","type":"comment","level":2,"id":"c-SaturnCat-20241012005400-MediaWiki_message_delivery-20241012003200","replies":["c-Buster7-20241012024500-SaturnCat-20241012005400"]}}-->
I am NOT a Morman. I do, however, prefer to be called "Elder" rather than Senior. My reasons are stated above and are enhanced by the bent and rusty bit of age-ism humor. Let it be known that henceforth and forever, I shall be known as "Elder Buster7". Buster Seven Talk (UTC) 02:45, 12 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20241012024500","author":"Buster7","type":"comment","level":3,"id":"c-Buster7-20241012024500-SaturnCat-20241012005400","replies":[],"displayName":"Buster Seven"}}-->
I have been thinking about this for sometime. I, at the age of 85, seems to be one of the oldest active wikipedians here. My view has changed somewhat. I now think we should delete anything that lists wikipedians by age. Age is just not important. I will delete my name from any such list. Bduke (talk) 02:28, 12 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20241012022800","author":"Bduke","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-Bduke-20241012022800-Elder_Wikipedians","replies":["c-Buaidh-20241012175900-Bduke-20241012022800"]}}-->
@Bduke: That is too bad. This is precisely the thrust of this project. We can really use you. I've made you an anonymous member of our project. Anyone else who would like to remain anonymous can do likewise. Please remain a member of our notice list to keep up with our future activities. Best, Buaidh talke-mail17:59, 12 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20241012175900","author":"Buaidh","type":"comment","level":2,"id":"c-Buaidh-20241012175900-Bduke-20241012022800","replies":["c-Jim.henderson-20241014024600-Buaidh-20241012175900"]}}-->
At only 76 I might not be as wise as some, but I like "ancient". Jim.henderson (talk) 02:46, 14 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20241014024600","author":"Jim.henderson","type":"comment","level":3,"id":"c-Jim.henderson-20241014024600-Buaidh-20241012175900","replies":["c-Buaidh-20241014211800-Jim.henderson-20241014024600"]}}-->
@Jim.henderson: Ancient is good. There are also aged, ageless, ancient, antique, dateless, elderly, geriatric, long-lived, mature, old, oldish, out-of-date, overaged, over-the-hill, past-prime, senescent, spavined, superannuated, unyoung, and venerable. I rather like senescent and unyoung. Senescent sounds like a mystic cult – The Senescent Order of Wikipedians. We certainly are unyoung!
Please sign our roster and help us choose. You can use the user name "anonymous member" if you wish to hide your antiquity. Buaidh talke-mail21:18, 14 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20241014211800","author":"Buaidh","type":"comment","level":4,"id":"c-Buaidh-20241014211800-Jim.henderson-20241014024600","replies":[]}}-->
