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Again, welcome!  --Paul E. Ester 14:32, 27 July 2006 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2006-07-27T14:32:00.000Z","author":"Paul E Ester","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-Paul_E_Ester-2006-07-27T14:32:00.000Z","replies":[],"displayName":"Paul E. Ester"}}-->

Dingman's Ferry is still a toll crossing. - UtherSRG (talk) 00:43, 12 August 2006 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2006-08-12T00:43:00.000Z","author":"UtherSRG","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-UtherSRG-2006-08-12T00:43:00.000Z-Dingman","replies":[]}}-->

Okay, I've been watching the revert fest on the Southwest Vacations link on the Southwest article. I'm curious what is your rationale for removing it? It is part of Southwest is it not? —Cliffb 00:54, 18 August 2006 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2006-08-18T00:54:00.000Z","author":"Cliffb","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-Cliffb-2006-08-18T00:54:00.000Z-Southwest_Vacations","replies":["c-Cliffb-2006-08-18T02:27:00.000Z-Cliffb-2006-08-18T00:54:00.000Z"]}}-->

Fair enough -- perhaps in future removals that could be cited -- I doubt the links are being added out of malice, just a lack of understanding why it isn't there.. —Cliffb 02:27, 18 August 2006 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2006-08-18T02:27:00.000Z","author":"Cliffb","type":"comment","level":2,"id":"c-Cliffb-2006-08-18T02:27:00.000Z-Cliffb-2006-08-18T00:54:00.000Z","replies":[]}}-->

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Boston, Ontario is not a hoax. It is listed as an unincorporated area in the Atlas of Canada http://atlas.nrcan.gc.ca -- TruthbringerToronto (Talk | contribs) 16:59, 18 August 2006 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2006-08-18T16:59:00.000Z","author":"TruthbringerToronto","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-TruthbringerToronto-2006-08-18T16:59:00.000Z-Boston,_Ontario","replies":[]}}-->

The njsr succession boxes are not needed for any New Jersey state routes with an infobox, as the data is already at the bottom of the infoboxes. Alansohn 04:25, 24 August 2006 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2006-08-24T04:25:00.000Z","author":"Alansohn","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-Alansohn-2006-08-24T04:25:00.000Z-njsr_succession_boxes","replies":[]}}-->

i just wrote the article, rechceck it it does link now dude.

and p.s. whats the abseball projecta ll about, im kind of a huge A's fan, [see!] Qrc2006 01:19, 4 September 2006 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2006-09-04T01:19:00.000Z","author":"Qrc2006","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-Qrc2006-2006-09-04T01:19:00.000Z-dendrofiliac","replies":[]}}-->

thanks man, yeah it didnt exist yet cuz i was like working on it and stuff hahha and i didnt want to submit it basicly to avoid a speedy and even a afd before it was off the ground n shit

im nominated for system operator (sysop) or admin vote for me please! here

Please note that lack of notability isn't a CSD for businesses. You've gotta use prod and afd instead. Regards, alphaChimp^(talk) 04:07, 10 September 2006 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2006-09-10T04:07:00.000Z","author":"Alphachimp","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-Alphachimp-2006-09-10T04:07:00.000Z-WP:CSD","replies":[]}}-->

Verify it first. Then go to a Yankee game or listen on the radio. You will hear it every game. Chivista 19:42, 11 September 2006 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2006-09-11T19:42:00.000Z","author":"Chivista","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-Chivista-2006-09-11T19:42:00.000Z-If_you_don't_know_the_theme_from_Zorba","replies":[]}}-->

I was just taking a look at this article, and was trying to figure out if there was a speedy category that would be appropriate. I see nothing in the article that is salvagable, and it does not even qualify as a webcomic, since he says the website is not up yet. No notability, and not a well-written article. It's a pity that some people can't tell the difference between Wikipedia and MySpace. ---Charles 05:02, 16 November 2006 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2006-11-16T05:02:00.000Z","author":"Theoldanarchist","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-Theoldanarchist-2006-11-16T05:02:00.000Z-Robot_curfman","replies":["c-Michael_Greiner-2006-11-16T05:07:00.000Z-Theoldanarchist-2006-11-16T05:02:00.000Z"],"displayName":"Charles"}}-->

I didn't see any speedy category either and that's why I prodded it. If it gets deprodded, I will take it to Afd. Michael Greiner 05:07, 16 November 2006 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2006-11-16T05:07:00.000Z","author":"Michael Greiner","type":"comment","level":2,"id":"c-Michael_Greiner-2006-11-16T05:07:00.000Z-Theoldanarchist-2006-11-16T05:02:00.000Z","replies":["c-Theoldanarchist-2006-11-16T18:20:00.000Z-Michael_Greiner-2006-11-16T05:07:00.000Z"]}}-->

Yeah, I thought about db-nonsense, but I really think that one gets used in places where it is not truly appropriate, so I erred on the side of caution. A prod works, and I have a feeling, nothing will be done with the article until the time comes that it is deleted. Just a hunch. ---Charles 18:20, 16 November 2006 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2006-11-16T18:20:00.000Z","author":"Theoldanarchist","type":"comment","level":3,"id":"c-Theoldanarchist-2006-11-16T18:20:00.000Z-Michael_Greiner-2006-11-16T05:07:00.000Z","replies":[],"displayName":"Charles"}}-->

If you check the contribs of the article creator, he/she builds articles about past people/authors/books. The article's name is listed as being part of a book in another article this person worked on. I was going to tag it csd bio but just left it on my watchlist. That's when I saw your tag. Ronbo76 01:02, 7 February 2007 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2007-02-07T01:02:00.000Z","author":"Ronbo76","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-Ronbo76-2007-02-07T01:02:00.000Z-re:_James_Jackson_Jarves","replies":[]}}-->

Please see our fair use criteria, specifically number 8: "The material must contribute significantly to the article (e.g. identify the subject of an article, or specifically illustrate relevant points or sections within the text) and must not serve a purely decorative purpose." The use of the GSP shield in the infobox does not do this. --NE2 22:31, 9 February 2007 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2007-02-09T22:31:00.000Z","author":"NE2","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-NE2-2007-02-09T22:31:00.000Z-GSP_shield","replies":[]}}-->

I deleted the prod because I found some more info on the book including that it won at least two awards. The author, mentioned by the article's writer in the talk page but not in the article itself, has also written several books. So, it seems notable to me and not some random page. Look at my changes and if you still think it should be deleted, please put it up for discussion. Cathy —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 172.166.117.206 (talk) 14:37, 13 February 2007 (UTC).__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2007-02-13T14:37:00.000Z","author":"172.166.117.206","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-172.166.117.206-2007-02-13T14:37:00.000Z-Up_from_Jericho_Tel","replies":[]}}-->

Hey Michael - the reason I deleted "In their own defense" in the Southwest Airlines article is because of the NPOV policy of letting the facts speak for themselves. I think "In their own defense" is actually redundant and slightly editorializing in this context. Cheers --Matt 20:58, 30 March 2007 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2007-03-30T20:58:00.000Z","author":"Mlaroche","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-Mlaroche-2007-03-30T20:58:00.000Z-Southwest_Airlines_Flight_1763","replies":["c-Mlaroche-2007-03-30T21:01:00.000Z-Mlaroche-2007-03-30T20:58:00.000Z"],"displayName":"Matt"}}-->

Plus, I think the sentence is tighter without it. --Matt 21:01, 30 March 2007 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2007-03-30T21:01:00.000Z","author":"Mlaroche","type":"comment","level":2,"id":"c-Mlaroche-2007-03-30T21:01:00.000Z-Mlaroche-2007-03-30T20:58:00.000Z","replies":["c-Michael_Greiner-2007-03-30T21:36:00.000Z-Mlaroche-2007-03-30T21:01:00.000Z"],"displayName":"Matt"}}-->

The sentence wasn't the best I agree, but the three cites support that the death was caused by actions of the passengers in self defense and that is not clearly explained by the sentence. Reading the article, it could be inferred that he died from injuries occurring when breaking down the cockpit door, not from other passengers. Michael Greiner 21:36, 30 March 2007 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2007-03-30T21:36:00.000Z","author":"Michael Greiner","type":"comment","level":3,"id":"c-Michael_Greiner-2007-03-30T21:36:00.000Z-Mlaroche-2007-03-30T21:01:00.000Z","replies":[]}}-->

Hello, Michael Greiner (if that is your real name). It isn't a really good idea to include the rosters as the information changes (not added onto, but changed entirely). Plus, at the end of the season, what roster will you put here? Because of this, a current roster isn't gonna be of any use to anybody looking at the article 20 years from now. Do you catch my drift? Ksy92003 23:10, 4 April 2007 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2007-04-04T23:10:00.000Z","author":"Ksy92003","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-Ksy92003-2007-04-04T23:10:00.000Z-2007_Articles\/Rosters","replies":[]}}-->

Hey Mike. Can I call you Mike? Okay, well, I'm the guy who put up that article on intrepid Aversion, and I don't really understand why it wasnt "notable". I also would like to know if I could add anything to make it meet the guidlines here. I definetly could find more information, if that is the problem, and I think that all bands should be included on Wikipedia, for those who need or want the information, or are just bored and doing random internet searches. I was doing a random web search and found a site. I listened to some music there(which has since been temporarily deleted for technical reasons)and liked it. I found out that the band I heard was called Intrepid Aversion, and thought that the wikipedia would be a great place to tell people about them, or at least put the information out there. Please help me out and respond on my talk page.--Uberpro128 21:45, 9 April 2007 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2007-04-09T21:45:00.000Z","author":"Uberpro128","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-Uberpro128-2007-04-09T21:45:00.000Z-Intrepid_Aversion","replies":[]}}-->

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Hi, I'd like to know why you made this edit with the description "fix links". How was your edit an improvement to the article, and what prompted you to make that change? I'm only concerned because it appears to be a personal bias rather than an unbiased contribution. If you could, let's talk on Talk:Woot. Thanks. Ironiridis 19:57, 12 April 2007 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2007-04-12T19:57:00.000Z","author":"Ironiridis","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-Ironiridis-2007-04-12T19:57:00.000Z-Interesting_edit...","replies":["c-Ironiridis-2007-04-16T16:26:00.000Z-Ironiridis-2007-04-12T19:57:00.000Z"]}}-->

Sorry, I saw your explanation before and understood your edits. I've been in and out of town, so it's tough to keep track of that stuff. My apologies. Ironiridis 16:26, 16 April 2007 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2007-04-16T16:26:00.000Z","author":"Ironiridis","type":"comment","level":2,"id":"c-Ironiridis-2007-04-16T16:26:00.000Z-Ironiridis-2007-04-12T19:57:00.000Z","replies":[]}}-->

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Hi ... I'm leaving you this note because you recently made edits to one of the Major League Baseball roster pages. I've made a proposal for standardizing the format, structure and content of these pages here and would appreciate your input so that we may reach a consensus. Thanks. --Sanfranman59 05:29, 23 April 2007 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2007-04-23T05:29:00.000Z","author":"Sanfranman59","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-Sanfranman59-2007-04-23T05:29:00.000Z-Seeking_community_input_re_standardizing_baseball_roster_pages","replies":[]}}-->

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Thank you for joining. It is my first WikiProject. --Pupster21 Talk To Me 13:40, 29 April 2007 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2007-04-29T13:40:00.000Z","author":"Pupster21","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-Pupster21-2007-04-29T13:40:00.000Z-WP:YANKEES","replies":[]}}-->

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O I'm sorry. I'm not completley savvy and up to date on all these protection policy things, so an indefinite semi-protection would be the best thing. Please consider granting it. Happyme22 01:51, 3 May 2007 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2007-05-03T01:51:00.000Z","author":"Happyme22","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-Happyme22-2007-05-03T01:51:00.000Z-Reagan_Protection","replies":["c-Happyme22-2007-05-03T02:01:00.000Z-Happyme22-2007-05-03T01:51:00.000Z"]}}-->

I applogize; I thought you were an administrator. Happyme22 02:01, 3 May 2007 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2007-05-03T02:01:00.000Z","author":"Happyme22","type":"comment","level":2,"id":"c-Happyme22-2007-05-03T02:01:00.000Z-Happyme22-2007-05-03T01:51:00.000Z","replies":[]}}-->

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In regards to your question, I am trying to get the infoboxs to have some sort of standard order, for example, all the players infobox's had all these stats listed, but I am just ordering them up so all the infoboxs have some sort of uniformity to them, so they are not a big mess. MetsFan153 03:13, 12 May 2007 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2007-05-12T03:13:00.000Z","author":"MetsFan153","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-MetsFan153-2007-05-12T03:13:00.000Z-Re:Infoxbox_Question","replies":[]}}-->

Referring to the edit summary in this edit: "punctuation goes inside of quotations". That used to be a hard fast rule, but it's changed to the point that now both are considered correct, and it isn't really worth it to change from one to the other. Also, there are language differences here between British English and American English, and our style guidelines say it's not worth it to make edits that are just changing from one style to the other. --Cyde Weys 17:05, 13 May 2007 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2007-05-13T17:05:00.000Z","author":"Cyde","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-Cyde-2007-05-13T17:05:00.000Z-Regarding_punctuation","replies":[],"displayName":"Cyde Weys"}}-->

Thank you for your interest in VandalProof, Michael Greiner! You have now been added to the list of authorized users, so if you haven't already, simply download and install VandalProof from our main page. If you have any questions, please feel free to contact me or any other moderator, or you can post a message on the discussion page. Betacommand ^{(talk • contribs • Bot)} 19:57, 14 May 2007 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2007-05-14T19:57:00.000Z","author":"BetacommandBot","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-BetacommandBot-2007-05-14T19:57:00.000Z-Welcome_to_VandalProof!","replies":[],"displayName":"Bot"}}-->

I just put in a request to have him blocked.... Wikidan829 20:43, 14 May 2007 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2007-05-14T20:43:00.000Z","author":"Wikidan829","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-Wikidan829-2007-05-14T20:43:00.000Z-65.25.82.91","replies":[]}}-->

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Thanks for removing vandalism from my user page. Michael Greiner 19:33, 25 May 2007 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2007-05-25T19:33:00.000Z","author":"Michael Greiner","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-Michael_Greiner-2007-05-25T19:33:00.000Z-Vandalism_removal","replies":["c-Wikidan829-2007-05-25T19:37:00.000Z-Michael_Greiner-2007-05-25T19:33:00.000Z"]}}-->

de nada Wikidan829 19:37, 25 May 2007 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2007-05-25T19:37:00.000Z","author":"Wikidan829","type":"comment","level":2,"id":"c-Wikidan829-2007-05-25T19:37:00.000Z-Michael_Greiner-2007-05-25T19:33:00.000Z","replies":[]}}-->

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I'm confused. You changed my "15th" to "fifteenth," then quoted me the rule that said in effect that "15th" is fine.

The rule being ... "Whole numbers from zero to ten should be spelled out as words in the body of an article. Use numerals in tables and infoboxes. *Numbers above ten may be written out if they are expressed in two or fewer words, except in tables and infoboxes.... Within a context or a list, style should be consistent. Example: There were 5 cats, 12 dogs, and 32 birds or There were five cats, twelve dogs, and thirty-two birds...."

There is nothing wrong, therefore, with the way that I had it. IMHO.--Epeefleche 04:44, 4 June 2007 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2007-06-04T04:44:00.000Z","author":"Epeefleche","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-Epeefleche-2007-06-04T04:44:00.000Z-Numbers","replies":[]}}-->

Hi. Thoughts on this?--Epeefleche 04:31, 6 June 2007 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2007-06-06T04:31:00.000Z","author":"Epeefleche","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-Epeefleche-2007-06-06T04:31:00.000Z-Numbers","replies":[]}}-->

Hi there. I came to you because you are the one who pointed out to Soxrock that he violated WP:NOT#PUBLISHER. Well, in my opinion, another user, Chrishomingtang has violated the same rule. He did a similar edit to the ones that got Soxrock warned (see [1], [2], [3]). When I warned him about this violation, he just said "I didn't violate any rule." He still says that now, even though I've proven to him that he has, since an admin agreed also. See discussions at User talk:Ksy92003, Talk:2007 NBA Playoffs, and User talk:Chrishomingtang for the discussions that have taken place about this topic. Thanks. --Ksy92003 (talk) 23:34, 4 June 2007 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2007-06-04T23:34:00.000Z","author":"Ksy92003","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-Ksy92003-2007-06-04T23:34:00.000Z-Help_me_please.","replies":[]}}-->

Ignore the above message, since me and ksy92003 are close to have a compromise, but he wants me to check in with you. Our discussion is that regardless of rule violation, I will update the score exactly 2 min before game end, but not before that (since 2 min left usually decide the game) (if the game is still close [within 10 points], then I will not update until the end). Now, he said you are the first person to point this out. Do you accept this compromise. I think it is fair enough Chris 23:56, 4 June 2007 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2007-06-04T23:56:00.000Z","author":"Chrishomingtang","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-Chrishomingtang-2007-06-04T23:56:00.000Z-Help_me_please.","replies":[],"displayName":"Chris"}}-->

Alright fine, I will not update. But I still insist that score update before it end doesn't break any rule. But I stop because I believe in WP:CON and WP:NOT#BATTLEGROUND. Chris 00:09, 5 June 2007 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2007-06-05T00:09:00.000Z","author":"Chrishomingtang","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-Chrishomingtang-2007-06-05T00:09:00.000Z-Help_me_please.","replies":[],"displayName":"Chris"}}-->

Oh, I don't believe that you have nothing to do with this argument. In the argument, Ksy92003 kept mention your name. Besides, I see that you ask the help desk about blocking user that seems to be violating WP:NOT. Chris 00:29, 5 June 2007 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2007-06-05T00:29:00.000Z","author":"Chrishomingtang","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-Chrishomingtang-2007-06-05T00:29:00.000Z-Help_me_please.","replies":["c-Ksy92003-2007-06-05T00:39:00.000Z-Chrishomingtang-2007-06-05T00:29:00.000Z"],"displayName":"Chris"}}-->

I wasn't trying to infer that. I mentioned you solely because you were the first one to acknowledge that what Soxrock did was in violation of WP:NOT. What I was doing do Chrishomingtang was partly based on what you said to Soxrock and what Wizardman said about Soxrock, as well. I wasn't trying to treat you like an admin or anything, but I was hoping that, since you know the rule well enough to realize that Soxrock was violating it, than maybe you could explain it to Chris. --Ksy92003 (talk) 00:39, 5 June 2007 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2007-06-05T00:39:00.000Z","author":"Ksy92003","type":"comment","level":2,"id":"c-Ksy92003-2007-06-05T00:39:00.000Z-Chrishomingtang-2007-06-05T00:29:00.000Z","replies":[]}}-->

Never mind. Chris 01:01, 5 June 2007 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2007-06-05T01:01:00.000Z","author":"Chrishomingtang","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-Chrishomingtang-2007-06-05T01:01:00.000Z-Help_me_please.","replies":[],"displayName":"Chris"}}-->

Since your point is that YES is the only 1 of the 4 that broadcasts one of the Big 4 professional sports year round, than you it should say specifically that. But it is false to say that YES is the only network to broadcast year-round. MSG, for example, is broadcasting boxing, Liberty basketball, MLS soccer, and many other sports this summer. Either correct the sentence or it should be removed. Simon12 01:53, 5 June 2007 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2007-06-05T01:53:00.000Z","author":"Simon12","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-Simon12-2007-06-05T01:53:00.000Z-YES_in_Yankees_artcle","replies":[]}}-->

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Hey Michael, I was just wondering if you knew what "order added" meant on the chart on the Southwest Airlines destinations page? Thanks Sox23 23:14, 20 June 2007 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2007-06-20T23:14:00.000Z","author":"Sox23","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-Sox23-2007-06-20T23:14:00.000Z-SWA_Destinations_Chart","replies":["c-Sox23-2007-06-21T04:01:00.000Z-Sox23-2007-06-20T23:14:00.000Z"],"displayName":"Sox"}}-->

That would make sense. Thanks a lot for your help! Sox23 04:01, 21 June 2007 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2007-06-21T04:01:00.000Z","author":"Sox23","type":"comment","level":2,"id":"c-Sox23-2007-06-21T04:01:00.000Z-Sox23-2007-06-20T23:14:00.000Z","replies":[],"displayName":"Sox"}}-->

It was a Monty Python and the Holy Grail reference, wasn't it? Marnanel 01:09, 21 June 2007 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2007-06-21T01:09:00.000Z","author":"Marnanel","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-Marnanel-2007-06-21T01:09:00.000Z-moose\/sister","replies":["c-Michael_Greiner-2007-06-21T01:13:00.000Z-Marnanel-2007-06-21T01:09:00.000Z"]}}-->

Quite possibly, but it was still random. --Michael Greiner 01:13, 21 June 2007 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2007-06-21T01:13:00.000Z","author":"Michael Greiner","type":"comment","level":2,"id":"c-Michael_Greiner-2007-06-21T01:13:00.000Z-Marnanel-2007-06-21T01:09:00.000Z","replies":[]}}-->

Hello Michael,

I did make some edits (as 71.143.13.127) to remedy a few incorrect statements in the current edit of the Spin (flight) page. While I do not think that anyone should be getting their spin training advice from wikipedia, in the interest of being correct, I think the edits should be permitted. The consequences of incorrect understanding of spin recovery techniques are fairly high (often fatal), and I think it's a worthwhile point to have correct just in case anyone IS learning about spin recovery from wiki (that is the idea isn't it?)

It's simply not true that PARE leads to crossover spins, PAER may, but there is a reason it is PARE and not PAER. . .the order of operations is important.

The person who authored the current edit failed to correctly state the final step of the PARE process, and given their lack of understanding of the technique I can see why they might, without being trained in the method, incorrectly think that a crossover is a probable outcome in something like a Pitts or Extra. The absence of "to/through neutral" in the current edit does not communicate what must be done with the elevator when you reach the final step, and that detail is critical to avoiding accelerated spins rather than spin recoveries. I'm well versed in the various spin recovery methods, and fly the, Citabria/Decathlon series, the Pitts S-2B, S-2C, Extra 300L, and Edge 540, and PARE is the standard means for recovery in all the types I know of (with in spin aileron used to expedite spins in certain aircraft, but that isn't taught initially as the risk of using outspin aileron is high). I haven't flown the Yaks, or Sukhois I know many an airshow pilot or competition pilots who do, and Beggs-Mueller doesn't work in those, or the Citabria/Decathlon series when at more rearward center of gravity.

The most certain recovery technique is PARE, which is also known as the "NASA Standard Method" (it's NASA's standard for a reason!). The previous edit advocates the Beggs-Mueller technique as being the correct one for dedicated aerobatic aircraft. . it does work in many types as an emergency spin recovery technique particularly the Pitts, however recovery is delayed compared to PARE. In many aerobatic aircraft it works only when at forward most center of gravity, and in others it simply doesn't work at all. . . including the most commonly flown aerobatic trainers, the Citabria/Decathlon line, and the Yak 52. PARE works the majority of the time, assuming recovery is possible at all, and only requires the recognition of the direction of yaw and the implementation of the steps, in order:

Power -- idle Ailerons -- neutral Rudder -- full opposite and held Elevator -- through neutral (as soon as the other steps are complete)

So why is this clarification "not constructive"?

Thanks in advance for your time, and apologies if I didn't go about this in the correct way, I'm not exceptionally well versed in wikipedia just yet.

-Brett

"The only edit you made to the article was to add an external link to a flight school. Please in the future contact Wikipedia users through their user talk pages." - Mike Greiner

No, the four edits you reverted on the topic I previously wrote about were mine, however I guess I wasn't logged in (71.143.13.127). I did intend to include a reference to the stall spin textbooks that deal with it, but I can see how that might seem like advertising and have no issue at all with that being removed, however you reverted more than that, and things that really must be dealt with in the interest of accuracy, and safety.

Here is a link to the comparison page. Admittedly I should have done a little more proofing before submitting. . .but the intentions were good!

http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Spin_%28flight%29&diff=140021225&oldid=140021118

As mentioned before, the following section isn't accurate, and should be corrected:

"In aircraft that spin readily upright and inverted, such as Pitts Specials and other high performance aerobatic aircraft, the 'PARE' procedure may simply lead to the spin crossing from erect to inverted. In such aircraft the recommended generic solution is to close power, let go of the control stick/column, and push the anti-spin rudder (aka the Muller/Beggs technique). In an erect spin, the direction of roll and yaw are the same, so the direction of rudder to apply is obvious. In an inverted spin, the roll and yaw are opposite which may lead to confusion - hence the further advice to simply 'push the rudder pedal that is hardest to push'."

Additionally, the PARE steps should include the actions at each step correctly as well.

-Brett

Follow up:

The problematic edit was made by an anonymous user with the ip of 60.234.145.60 on June 18th and adds some misinformation to the article. The Beggs-Mueller technique must be mentioned, and has a definite place in emergency maneuvers training but this user does not understand the primary purpose of that technique as an emergency technique, and one that may not work in many other situations. This contributor also does not understand the PARE or NASA Standard Technique. It's simply irresponsible to allow it to remain as it is currently written, particularly given that the bulk of readers will be flying aircraft that demand an active recovery method with respect to the elevator control. BrettGoldsmith 01:19, 24 June 2007 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2007-06-24T01:19:00.000Z","author":"BrettGoldsmith","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-BrettGoldsmith-2007-06-24T01:19:00.000Z-Spin_(flight)","replies":[]}}-->

I have made a comment on this talk page regarding your reversion of my edit. Could you please explain it? JHMM13^(Disc) 03:08, 24 June 2007 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2007-06-24T03:08:00.000Z","author":"JHMM13","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-JHMM13-2007-06-24T03:08:00.000Z-Talk:New_Jersey_Devils","replies":[]}}-->

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Hey Michael, don't feel bad about your spelling, my spelling really stinks. I've recently fixed my posting here, now I've mis-spelled my own 'Edit Summary'. Trust me, my spelling mistakes are legendary. GoodDay 23:57, 26 June 2007 (UTC)__DTREPLYBUTTONSCONTENT__-->__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2007-06-26T23:57:00.000Z","author":"GoodDay","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-GoodDay-2007-06-26T23:57:00.000Z-New_Jersey_Devils","replies":[]}}-->

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