Hi again Aoba. I know you're on wikibreak rn, but once you're free; can you possibly help/locate more sources for Claire Redfield's reception? I couldn't find more for it to be expanded sadly. Thanks! 🍕BP!🍕 (🔔) 15:19, 28 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20241128151900","author":"Boneless Pizza!","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-Boneless_Pizza!-20241128151900-Hidden_sources","replies":["c-Aoba47-20241128220000-Boneless_Pizza!-20241128151900"],"displayName":"BP!"}}-->

• @Boneless Pizza!: I will look for sources either later today or sometime tomorrow. Would you prefer that I post any additional sources that I find here or somewhere else? I hope you are having a great week so far. Aoba47 (talk) 22:00, 28 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20241128220000","author":"Aoba47","type":"comment","level":2,"id":"c-Aoba47-20241128220000-Boneless_Pizza!-20241128151900","replies":["c-Boneless_Pizza!-20241128220100-Aoba47-20241128220000"]}}-->

  Hi. You can post it here at your talk page. Thank you! Have a great weekend aswell. 🍕BP!🍕 (🔔) 22:01, 28 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20241128220100","author":"Boneless Pizza!","type":"comment","level":3,"id":"c-Boneless_Pizza!-20241128220100-Aoba47-20241128220000","replies":["c-Aoba47-20241129032500-Boneless_Pizza!-20241128220100"],"displayName":"BP!"}}-->

@Boneless Pizza!: I honestly could not find much else. I looked for more scholarly coverage on places like Google Scholar, and I tried going for coverage on places like Newspapers.com to get coverage from when the games were first release. I could not really find anything that substantial. It seems that you may have found everything. It may be worthwhile to check out reviews of the games and films that include her, but based on my search, none of the articles I found really talk about her at all other than giving a cursory explanation of her character.

There is this book, Heroic Girls as Figures of Resistance and Futurity in Popular Culture, and the first chapter, "The Narratives of Survival: Final Girls in Videogames", may be helpful. I cannot access it through either the Wikipedia Library or Google Books, but it may be worth asking at the resource request. I cannot guarantee that it would be useful, but it appears the chapter at least references Redfield in some capacity.

Again, I am not that familiar with Resident Evil. My experience is limited to watching my brother play one of the early ones back in the 90's and seeing the Paul W. S. Anderson movies so I could be overlooking something. Homeostasis07 was the primary editor for the Jill Valentine FAC (and honestly deserves all the credit for it). From my experience, a big part of doing research is knowing the right search words and experimenting with different combinations and parameters. Sorry for not being much help with this. Best of luck with the FAC! Aoba47 (talk) 03:25, 29 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20241129032500","author":"Aoba47","type":"comment","level":4,"id":"c-Aoba47-20241129032500-Boneless_Pizza!-20241128220100","replies":["c-Boneless_Pizza!-20241129104500-Aoba47-20241129032500"]}}-->

Its okay. I really appreciate for all your help since Ada's article. Have a great day! 🍕BP!🍕 (🔔) 10:45, 29 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20241129104500","author":"Boneless Pizza!","type":"comment","level":5,"id":"c-Boneless_Pizza!-20241129104500-Aoba47-20241129032500","replies":["c-Boneless_Pizza!-20241201030300-Boneless_Pizza!-20241129104500"],"displayName":"BP!"}}-->

@Aoba47 It has this but I don't know how to paraphrase and not sure if this is worth adding. WDYT?

In the remakes of Resident Evil 2 and Resident Evil 3, a subtle way of establishing the Final Girl’s attitude to their situation can occur during combat. When the player chooses to aim a weapon held by the protagonist (Claire Redfield or Jill Valentine) towards an enemy, during combat with the enemy, or after the enemy has been defeated, a semi-random situational quip or ‘dialogue bark’ will be triggered by these actions. This line will speak directly to the opponent or be used as a pep talk for the character to carry on with their survival ambitions. The combat itself is an emergent narrative, but the interactive narrative works in tandem as both a directional, formal narrative commentary for the player and to add characterisation to the Final Girl’s character in a way that shows how they differ from their male counterparts in an identical situation (Beaulieu 2020).

🍕BP!🍕 (🔔) 03:03, 1 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20241201030300","author":"Boneless Pizza!","type":"comment","level":6,"id":"c-Boneless_Pizza!-20241201030300-Boneless_Pizza!-20241129104500","replies":["c-Aoba47-20241201030500-Boneless_Pizza!-20241201030300"],"displayName":"BP!"}}-->

I do think that it would be worth adding. It is an interesting analysis, but it has more to do with how Resident Evil does comabat with its female characters and is less about Redfield in particular. Redfield feels more like a mention or an example for something else and not the focus so it would not really fit the scope of her article. Aoba47 (talk) 03:05, 1 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20241201030500","author":"Aoba47","type":"comment","level":7,"id":"c-Aoba47-20241201030500-Boneless_Pizza!-20241201030300","replies":["c-Boneless_Pizza!-20241201030800-Aoba47-20241201030500"]}}-->

I see. I guess Claire's reception is 2x shorter than Ada. Many thanks again! 🍕BP!🍕 (🔔) 03:08, 1 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20241201030800","author":"Boneless Pizza!","type":"comment","level":8,"id":"c-Boneless_Pizza!-20241201030800-Aoba47-20241201030500","replies":["c-Aoba47-20241201035200-Boneless_Pizza!-20241201030800"],"displayName":"BP!"}}-->

Sometimes, that just happens. I would honestly just treat each article as its own separate thing and not compare lengths like that, but that is just my opinion of course. Aoba47 (talk) 03:52, 1 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20241201035200","author":"Aoba47","type":"comment","level":9,"id":"c-Aoba47-20241201035200-Boneless_Pizza!-20241201030800","replies":["c-Boneless_Pizza!-20241201041300-Aoba47-20241201035200"]}}-->

Fair enough 🍕BP!🍕 (🔔) 04:13, 1 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20241201041300","author":"Boneless Pizza!","type":"comment","level":10,"id":"c-Boneless_Pizza!-20241201041300-Aoba47-20241201035200","replies":[],"displayName":"BP!"}}-->

@Boneless Pizza!: Congratulations on the FAC promotion btw! Aoba47 (talk) 04:15, 2 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20241202041500","author":"Aoba47","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-Aoba47-20241202041500-Hidden_sources","replies":["c-Boneless_Pizza!-20241202041600-Aoba47-20241202041500"]}}-->

Many thanks! 🍕BP!🍕 (🔔) 04:16, 2 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20241202041600","author":"Boneless Pizza!","type":"comment","level":2,"id":"c-Boneless_Pizza!-20241202041600-Aoba47-20241202041500","replies":["c-Boneless_Pizza!-20241207230700-Boneless_Pizza!-20241202041600"],"displayName":"BP!"}}-->

Hey again Aoba. I am wondering if you can also review her brother, Chris Redfield, and leave some comments at Wikipedia:Peer review/Chris Redfield/archive1? If you're busy, it's fine it can stay as is. Many thanks! 🍕BP!🍕 (🔔) 23:07, 7 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20241207230700","author":"Boneless Pizza!","type":"comment","level":3,"id":"c-Boneless_Pizza!-20241207230700-Boneless_Pizza!-20241202041600","replies":["c-Aoba47-20241208002700-Boneless_Pizza!-20241207230700"],"displayName":"BP!"}}-->

I will check it out in the near future. Please ping me if for whatever reason I have not posted any comments by this time next week. Aoba47 (talk) 00:27, 8 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20241208002700","author":"Aoba47","type":"comment","level":4,"id":"c-Aoba47-20241208002700-Boneless_Pizza!-20241207230700","replies":["c-Boneless_Pizza!-20241208004900-Aoba47-20241208002700"]}}-->

Thank you very much! 🍕BP!🍕 (🔔) 00:49, 8 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20241208004900","author":"Boneless Pizza!","type":"comment","level":5,"id":"c-Boneless_Pizza!-20241208004900-Aoba47-20241208002700","replies":[],"displayName":"BP!"}}-->

Hi there. Busy with nominations? I nominated Kiruko from Heavenly Delusion to GA after its big copyedit but the first reviewer quit due to real life events. I tried to make sure the character article had proper pronouns considering it's the first time I nominate an article whose gender is discussed a lot by the narrative and themes from the author and third party sources. If possible could you give it a look? Cheers.Tintor2 (talk) 22:58, 16 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20241216225800","author":"Tintor2","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-Tintor2-20241216225800-Kiruko","replies":[]}}-->

• @Tintor2: I will look through the article later this week if that is okay with you. I will pay close attention to the use of pronouns and discussions on gender as you have requested. That being said, I do see issues with the citations so I wanted to point them out to you below:

• The Japanese and Spanish (and any foreign language) sources need a translation included in the citations for the titles.
• Items like Heavenly Delusion would need to be consistently italicized in the citation titles.
• This source has a credited author, who is not included in the citation formatting. It would be a good idea to use this as an opportunity to double check the other citations to make sure all of the available information is included.
• There are issues with the way that the websites/works and publishers are linked in the citations Game Rant is only linked in one citation (and not on the first instance even). I would be consistent with how things are linked. I think it is best to link for each citation.
• Avoid using words in all capital letters, as done for the citation for this source, and this goes for even when the source does this in their own titles.
• What makes Shashwat Publication a reliable publisher? I have the same question for Anime Feminist.

Again, I will look through the article more later in the week, but I would focus on these issues with the citations for now. By the way, have you tried reaching out to the GAN reviewer since their last post on the GAN? I hope you are having a great day so far. Aoba47 (talk) 03:20, 17 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20241217032000","author":"Aoba47","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-Aoba47-20241217032000-Kiruko","replies":[]}}-->

@Tintor2: I have started to look through the article. I will do a deeper dive either sometime tonight or sometime tomorrow. I am completely unfamiliar with Heavenly Delusion. I have a few clarification questions about it, but apologies in advance if any of this is obvious. In regards to pronoun usage, what pronouns does the character use in the manga and anime? What pronouns doe the coverage, both from the manga/anime creators and from the journalists and critics, use to reference the character?

An option to help potentially make this clear could be to add a note on the first pronoun usage in the lead to clarify why a specific pronoun is being used (like how it it is done for biographies on non-binary people, such as Hikaru Utada, or those on queer people, such as Lily Gladstone, or for those on transgender people, such as Elliot Page). It is just an idea of course so feel free to disagree with it. I hope this helps and makes sense. Aoba47 (talk) 17:37, 18 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20241218173700","author":"Aoba47","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-Aoba47-20241218173700-Kiruko","replies":["c-Tintor2-20241218174700-Aoba47-20241218173700"]}}-->

Thanks. The thing is that the series avoids Kiruko choosing one pronoun. If you read the talk page you will see that it's inconsistent. Initially, Kiruko says they are a woman but when confessing the truth to the other protagonist, Kiruko claims instead he is a man, Haruki. In more comical episodes, Kiruko has some sort of pride of a woman but isn't afraid of showing their naked body in front of Maru casually as they claim he is a guy after all. I guess it depends on the people Kiruko interacts with. To Maru and Robin, Kiruko confesses being a man while to the caretaker, Kiruko is a woman. The exact chapter of the caretaker has Kiruko pretending to be the sister, resulting in the character pronouns that are only used women in Japanese like "watashi" over "ore". Sorry if this is confusing. Tintor2 (talk) 17:47, 18 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20241218174700","author":"Tintor2","type":"comment","level":2,"id":"c-Tintor2-20241218174700-Aoba47-20241218173700","replies":["c-Aoba47-20241218200400-Tintor2-20241218174700"]}}-->

Thank you for the explanation. From my understanding, "watashi" is gender-neutral and not specifically used by women. I learned it and used it while learning Japanese for instance. It is unlike "ore", which is more so used by men.

Aside from that, it may be best to add a note to more directly explain to readers why a specific pronoun will be used throughout the article. Has they/them ever been used in the context of this character or the surrounding coverage? I know that it can be difficult to track this kind of gendered language in a different language and culture like Japanese, and even more so when the subject material is deliberately playing with and blurring gender in this way with the character. I would just be concerned about using they/them potentially being considered original research, especially if this type of pronoun is not used with the character in other spaces.

Sorry for not having a more straight-forward answer about this one. Maybe it would be helpful to reach out to some of the Wikiprojects, like Wikipedia:WikiProject Japan or Wikipedia:WikiProject LGBTQ+ studies? These are just some ideas to think about of course. Whatever direction you decide to take with this, I think that it is important to do something that establishes from the start why certain pronouns are being used. Aoba47 (talk) 20:04, 18 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20241218200400","author":"Aoba47","type":"comment","level":3,"id":"c-Aoba47-20241218200400-Tintor2-20241218174700","replies":["c-Tintor2-20241218212700-Aoba47-20241218200400"]}}-->

This is an interview with the author himself: https://www.animenewsnetwork.com/interview/2023-09-25/crafting-a-hell-in-heaven-with-heavenly-delusion-creator-masakazu-ishiguro/.201179

"Gender expression and sexual identity seem to be important themes in the story. How did you decide to approach this aspect regarding Kiruko and the school-like setting?

ISHIGURO: As for Kiruko, the character represents not a binary of “male” or “female” but rather a gradation of spiritual sexuality. The school is depicted as a kind of thought experiment in a world where sexual elements are abolished."

I'm not sure with how to exactly handle this response but I have seen this website using they for Kiruko during reviews since last year they used make reviews for the 13 episodes. Hope that helps. Tintor2 (talk) 21:27, 18 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20241218212700","author":"Tintor2","type":"comment","level":4,"id":"c-Tintor2-20241218212700-Aoba47-20241218200400","replies":["c-Aoba47-20241218231700-Tintor2-20241218212700","c-Aoba47-20241219034000-Tintor2-20241218212700"]}}-->

That does help a lot actually. I think that source justifies the usage of the they/them pronouns. It may be good to add some sort of note in the beginning about this. Something along the lines of they/them will be consistently used through the article except for instances that discuss their past identity as Haruki Takehaya or their sister's body. Thank you again for the response and for taking the time to explain this to me. Aoba47 (talk) 23:17, 18 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20241218231700","author":"Aoba47","type":"comment","level":5,"id":"c-Aoba47-20241218231700-Tintor2-20241218212700","replies":[]}}-->

It may be helpful to bring this article through the peer review process prior to a GAN. I did a brief copy-edit of part of the lead, and of course, feel free to revert anything that you disagree with. I was confused by one pronoun instance in the lead. Why is her used in reference to the gun? I was also uncertain about what was meant by this sentence: (In contrast to previous stories he read, Ishiguro wanted Kiruko's body change to be written in a realistic manner.) What is meant by "a realistic manner" in this context? The story itself is more of a science-fiction one and not particularly realistic one.

Apologies in advance as I will not be able to do a full GAN review for this article. I have the time to assist with FACs and peer reviews, but a GAN in my opinion does take quite a bit of time and work. Also, sorry for posting so many messages on here about this. I am just trying to help as much as I can right now. Aoba47 (talk) 03:40, 19 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20241219034000","author":"Aoba47","type":"comment","level":5,"id":"c-Aoba47-20241219034000-Tintor2-20241218212700","replies":["c-Tintor2-20241221005200-Aoba47-20241219034000"]}}-->

No problem. Thanks for giving so much attention. About realistic, it's probably because some other anime series write gender swap in a comical manner which Ishiguro didn't like so he wanted to give Kiruko a realistic take of a man experiencing a woman's body forever. The anime cut down some parts like when Kiruko is weakened and upon being treated in a hospital, it is revealed the body is going through its first period. Same with gender identity involving the relationship between the two leads. Maru early confesses Kiruko that he is in love with them which results in a rejection when Kiruko claims the true identity. Even after feeling depressed by the response, Maru keeps feeling attracted by Kiruko until one scene mentioned in the reception has Maru saying that while he doesn't know Haruki or Kiriko he is still in love with Kiruko and no gender identity can change such feelings. Anyways,I noticed Pizza nominated Chris to FA. It sure would be nice if most Resident Evil characters reach that status. Cheers. Tintor2 (talk) 00:52, 21 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20241221005200","author":"Tintor2","type":"comment","level":6,"id":"c-Tintor2-20241221005200-Aoba47-20241219034000","replies":["c-Aoba47-20241221023200-Tintor2-20241221005200"]}}-->

That makes sense. Thank you for the explanation. It would be great to see other Resident Evil characters become FAs in the future. It definitely inspires me to work on other fictional characters in the future. I went with something smaller and easier to ease my way back into doing projects on here for the time being, but as I have said before, fictional character articles are one of my favorite parts of Wikipedia. Aoba47 (talk) 02:32, 21 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20241221023200","author":"Aoba47","type":"comment","level":7,"id":"c-Aoba47-20241221023200-Tintor2-20241221005200","replies":["c-Boneless_Pizza!-20241221060200-Aoba47-20241221023200"]}}-->

Yah, I was very thankful you and Homeostasis07 brought Jill to FA status; which then inspired me to do other main Resident Evil protagonists as well. I aiming Leon S. Kennedy next, but that would require a lot of work :p. Looking forward to your next fictional character article. 🍕BP!🍕 (🔔) 06:02, 21 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20241221060200","author":"Boneless Pizza!","type":"comment","level":8,"id":"c-Boneless_Pizza!-20241221060200-Aoba47-20241221023200","replies":["c-Aoba47-20241221204700-Boneless_Pizza!-20241221060200"],"displayName":"BP!"}}-->

Thank you for the kind words. That really does mean a lot to me. I am looking forward to your work on the Leon article. I am not even sure what character I will pick next, but I am excited for it whenever I get around to doing another one. Aoba47 (talk) 20:47, 21 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"20241221204700","author":"Aoba47","type":"comment","level":9,"id":"c-Aoba47-20241221204700-Boneless_Pizza!-20241221060200","replies":[]}}-->